92: Attitude of Gratitude with Dalai Cote

0:08 Scott Ingram: You're listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast, where we deconstruct world-class sales performers to provide insights and strategies to help you improve. To learn more, visit us at top1.fm. Here's your host, Scott Ingram.

0:24 Scott Ingram: This episode is sponsored by the 2020 Sales Success Summit that will happen here in Austin on October 12th and 13th. For complete For complete details, click over to top1summit.com. Today on the Sales Success Stories podcast, my guest is Dalai Cote. Dal was the number one account executive at Loopio in 2019. Welcome to the show, Dal.

0:45 Dalai Cote: Hey Scott, thanks for having me. It's great to be here.

0:47 Scott Ingram: Yeah, glad to have you here. And we'll get into the story about how you got here after we go through… I'm always about just diving in, and I know you know this… getting to immediate value. So let's talk about the top 3 things that you believe have contributed the most to your success?

1:04 Dalai Cote: Sure. So the first is having a system and following it consistently throughout the sales process. You know, I believe that winners and losers often have the same goals. It's really their systems that set them apart. The second, Scott, is partnering with clients and partnering with them both at a personal and at an organizational level. And, you know, I'm a believer that buyers today buy from partners, not from vendors. So the approach that I take in building partnership has allowed me to develop stronger champions, close bigger deals, and deliver more value to my clients. And the third is making success part of my identity, right? Deciding the type of person that I wanted to be and proving it to myself with small wins. So I can certainly elaborate on any of that, but those would be my top 3.

1:44 Scott Ingram: Yes, let's. So why don't we go one at a time? So the first one was having a system, and that's what I love what you said there, that, you know, we all have the same goals, right? But it's how you execute and what you actually do. So what does that mean for you? How does that manifest for you?

1:56 Dalai Cote: So I think, look, like everyone sets goals, right? We all want to save more money. Or lose more weight, but very few people actually accomplish them. And I think it's really the same in sales, right? I always had goals. I wanted to break into a certain account or hit quota or go to club. And I spent a lot of time thinking and dreaming about these goals. But the reality is, is that winners and losers have the same goals, right? Like if you're Tom Brady, your goal is to win the Super Bowl, but your system might be the way that you approach practice, the food you eat, the players you recruit. And I really don't think it's any different in sales. Right? So it's that set of methods, the process that you follow consistently on every deal to help get where you want to go. So I think the number one contributor really has been putting together an effective system and then using goals as a direction.

2:40 Scott Ingram: Awesome. And we'll definitely come back to the system, so stick around, folks. Your second thing was building partnership and sort of differentiating between, you know, folks aren't looking for vendors, they're looking for partners. So what does that look like? How do you set that up? How do you really begin that type of conversation and relationship with those you're looking to do business with?

3:00 Dalai Cote: Yeah, it's a great question. And I think it starts really at the individual level. Right. And I think the reality is, is that especially when you're selling at the V and C level and when you're breaking into the enterprise, buyers today have an expectation that they want to work with, with partners. And for me, it's really about conveying to the client that they should have confidence in you, right? That you're competent, that every interaction is going to be valuable. And there's a number of things that I do to help build up really strong champions. And there's a number of things that I also do to help build up organizational partnership to ensure that at the organizational level between both companies, there's a really strong sense that we're not just a vendor, we're a partner that's invested in their success.

3:39 Scott Ingram: So I don't want to forget to ask about that. So why don't we go a little bit deeper on that here and just talk about what are those ways that you are building up your champions?

3:47 Dalai Cote: Sure. Yeah. So one of them is leading with value in every interaction, right? So early on in any client engagement, my number one goal is to provide value to the client as quickly as possible. And this helps me build credibility and rapport because you're putting the client at ease, right? You're signaling right off the bat that this session is going to be useful. And I think, Scott, buyers today are so used to be putting into seller-centric sales processes, right? Buyers are conditioned to be skeptical of salespeople. So you need to pattern break right off the bat, disrupt that expectation. What I found is that, you know, once you establish value, buyers are going to be a lot more likely to open up to you about their challenges and the impact that it's actually having on their business. Their guard's going to come come down a bit and they're gonna think like, hey, look, this guy actually might be able to help me. I'm gonna give him a chance. I'm gonna listen.

4:32 Scott Ingram: Now, how specifically are you doing that? What is that pattern interrupt?

4:36 Dalai Cote: So one thing that I don't ever do on calls, first calls, discovery calls, demos, whatever it may be, is start off by being focused on myself, right? Asking a ton of questions about, you know, my discovery questions, the things that I wanna learn from them. I'll ask a couple, ask a couple really pointed questions that, you know, I need to know to be able to deliver value. But what I wanna do as quickly as possible is start delivering some value. And don't get me wrong, right? Like we're certainly gonna focus on discovery, but I think of discovery as being a process that's gonna happen throughout the entire call, throughout the entire engagement, as opposed to something that's gonna happen, you know, right off the bat up front. And in that same vein, I'm also never gonna start with a slide deck. That's not necessary. And I think a lot of organizations, and it's something that, you know, I've seen in a lot of demos that I've listened in on, is slide decks have become customary, right? They're a part of the process, but unless what you're doing is really disruptive or it's something that, you know, requires a deck to help explain it, I don't know if it's necessary. I think let's get into value. Let's start showing what we want to show. Certainly not going to spend any time talking about, you know, how great my founding team is and, you know, all the millions of investments that I have and the millions of dollars in funding. I want to show, okay, these are the things that I know that we can help with. I want to get to that as quickly as I can to show the buyers that, hey, if you're going to invest some time with me, it's going to be really useful.

5:49 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So give it a real example because I think there's all of this talk about, hey, we should be delivering value. What does that actually mean in this context?

5:59 Dalai Cote: So usually for me, I want to understand like right off the bat is, is what is the reason that we're having this call, right? It's, it's the why now, like what actually compelled them to take that call. Once I have a decent understanding of that, I mean, that usually bleeds into pain. I want to get a sense of like, what are the specific challenges that we can help with? And then I want to start talking right away. Okay. It sounds like this is a challenge, Scott. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to talk to them really quickly about all the different ways that we can help that are coming to mind and all the things that I can potentially show them hitting on that pain, right? Hitting on that pain point. But also aligning it to other things that I know about their company, about their industry, talking about other companies that we've helped and other clients that we've helped in the same situation. Really high-level stuff, but right off the bat, right, getting them excited about, ooh, there's value here, there's things, there's really good nuggets. And it's actually really similar, you know, Scott, to what you do on this podcast, right? You start with a quick overview. These are a couple of core, core things, and then over time you build up into them. But your listeners right off the bat are going to decide, right, if they're starting their commute, Do I want to invest time into this podcast? And that gives them a really easy way to go, okay, yeah, this is valuable. This is relevant to me. I want to spend time here.

7:04 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Nice. Thanks for that example. So your last point was making success part of your identity. And I feel like we can probably get there if I ask you a bigger question, which is just to maybe give the context and tell the story about how we got here right now. And I know I owe David Weiss a big shout out for introducing us because he played a really significant role in this.

7:26 Dalai Cote: Yes, absolutely. And you know, I actually shared this story with David and I've shared it on LinkedIn in a few places, but 3 years ago, after making the jump from SDR to AE, and after about a year of slugging it out with very little success, I was caught in a round of layoffs and I was let go, right? I was struggling to stay afloat both professionally and financially. And I actually started thinking that maybe sales wasn't for me after all. I'd been incredibly successful, you know, as an SDR, but maybe I just wasn't cut out for that closing role. And I was really ready to hang up that headset and I actually started applying for roles outside of sales. And then, you know, a funny thing happened. I stumbled across this podcast, the Sales Success Story Podcast, and specifically the episode with David Weiss. I think it's, I think it's episode 24, and it really struck a nerve with me, right? It really fundamentally changed the way that I was thinking about selling. And David, in the podcast, for those people that haven't listened to it, I mean, I highly, highly recommend you check it out. He outlined how his approach had helped him become, right, the number one seller in his division at ADP. But how his process was teachable, right? It was learnable. He claimed anyone could do it. So I listened to that over and over and I got this nagging feeling to give it another shot. And I took another AE role and I dove in and I became a true student of sales, right? I implemented my top 3, which I'm sure we're gonna dive into in, in more detail today, and improved every single step of my process. And the results started coming, right? In 2018, I hit quota for the first time. In 2019, I was the number 1 seller in the company, which is that same year that the company became the 13th fastest growing tech company. Here in Canada, and I broke a number of company records along the way.

8:58 Scott Ingram: That's awesome. I love that end-to-end story. I mean, it's exactly why I started these podcasts and why I wanted to have these conversations, right? It was to do exactly what you described, which is, hey, I want to be successful. I have the desire. And, you know, sure, you can read books and you can listen to other podcasts by folks who are telling you what to do, but I think it's different to hear the real-world experience of the people who are actually doing it and actually doing it Right now and being able to implement those strategies. And I know one of the other things that you talked about in one of the notes that I saw, maybe it was the LinkedIn post or maybe it was the note that you sent to David when you guys actually connected, was, you know, you kind of wore out the clip that I had pulled out where he talks about the MEDDIC process. Do you want to talk about that a little bit more?

9:45 Dalai Cote: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you know what, if anyone's listening to this and hasn't or doesn't know what MEDDIC is or hasn't even listened to that, I would highly recommend doing it. I mean, I have been hard pressed to find anything that's nearly as succinct and valuable and easy to implement as the process that David outlined when he was explaining MEDDIC. But for me, that was actually the first time that I came across it. And you know what, I had read a lot about different sales methodologies, and I certainly had spent a lot of time trying to implement them internally, but I didn't really have anything, you know, coming back to my top 3, I didn't really have a system that truly worked for me. So I think it's the second most watched video that you have, David's MEDDIC overview. I probably account for a large number of those views alone, but I would recommend Like if you haven't watched it, probably pause this right now. Go listen to that. It's so incredibly helpful.

10:32 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And we'll link up a bunch of stuff. I'm working on actually keeping track of my stinking episode numbers because I'm so bad about this, but this should be episode 92. So if you go to top1.fm/92 in the show notes, and obviously we'll have great quotes from Dal and links to everything that he's about to talk about and all this stuff, but I'm also going to link up all of the David Weiss stuff. And David has become a big kind of core part of this community. So this all started in episode 24. Absolutely. But we've done a couple of episodes since then. He has spoken at both of the previous Sales Success Summits. So if and when you join the listener list, I'll actually send you those videos from the summit. And in both of them, he goes deeper into the MEDDIC process. And what's amazing about David's story is when he came on to episode 24, he was talking about, hey, if you'll follow this process, you can double or triple your results. And Dal, I think you've proven that he wasn't just saying that, it's real. The follow-on episode that we did, because we did do a full-blown episode later, he then stepped into a leadership role and he took a team that was kind of a middling, probably a little bit underperforming team, the same players. I mean, this wasn't he brought in his guys and he brought in some superstars and juiced the numbers. He took that same team and made them the number 1 team at ADP and achieved the board of directors level performance. And almost everybody went to club. I mean, it's an amazing achievement that shows all of the stuff that he's talking about is legit. And you resemble that as well.

12:07 Dalai Cote: Yeah. And it's so funny that you mentioned that, right? Because that was actually, I think it's what it's titled is, you know, how David 2x'd his results or 2 or 3x'd his results. I literally doubled my sales number, right, over the year before. And I hit quota in 2018, but I was promoted in the process that, you know, came with an increase in quota, quotas also went up at the starting of the year. So my actual sales dollars between 2018 and 2019 were over 2 times the amount, right? 200% increase, which is pretty incredible. I think it's such a testament that, you know, he has a formula. It really works. And I'm going to talk about some of the things today that I've specifically drawn from it and also some of the experiences and some of the things that I've added to it. But if you're struggling right now where you're not at the top and you want somewhere to start, go back to that episode, listen to it, And reach out to him. Like, he's happy to help. He's so eager. I mean, I think leadership is just something that he exudes. So do yourself a favor, give it a listen, reach out to him, reach out to me. I'm happy to chat. It was such a transformational piece of really of my sales training. And it was, you know, all through this community here. So Scott, I got to thank you for that as well, for putting this together. It's really changed my life.

13:14 Scott Ingram: Yeah, absolutely. And that is the perfect transition into the one commercial I'll give. We'll talk for a really long time. And this is the only thing that I do that generates any kind of revenue. And that is just talking about the Sales Success Summit. So this year, this will be the 3rd annual event. This is built for this Sales Success Community. It's happening here in Austin on October 12th and 13th, and this event is different from every other sales conference out there because it exclusively features these top-performing sales professionals that you've heard here on the podcast. So guys like David Weiss, guys like Dal. And my rule for guests on this show is they have to be active quota-carrying individual contributors, and they're either the outright number one top seller in the organization, or they're at least the top 1% of performers on a very, very large team. So you won't find the gurus and the quote-unquote sales experts on the stage at this event. This is only real practitioners like Dal. It's going to be an intimate experience. We cap that out at just under 200 participants, and this is again just an opportunity for us to all learn from each other. So all of the details for the summer are top1summit.com. That's the number 1, T-O-P, the number 1 summit.com. And the sooner you register, the better your price as the tickets increase $50 per month until we just sell them all out. So again, top1summit.com. And Dal, I know you're going to be here with us this year, mostly so you can meet David.

14:46 Dalai Cote: I can't wait. It's going to be great. I wanted to make it this past year and I was actually at a wedding. Almost had purchased the ticket. So this year, fingers crossed that nothing gets in the way of that, but I'm fully intent on making it. I can't wait.

14:55 Scott Ingram: Yeah, absolutely. I think we all have fingers crossed that nothing gets in the way, just given world events, but I think we'll be fine. And no matter what, we will find a way to deliver that experience and this opportunity to connect as a community and just really come together, learn from each other, grow, find what's working right now, because that's shifting and changing for all of us. So, Dal, let's, let's do 2 things. Let's talk just a little bit more If you could kind of quantify your results in some more specificity, if you can. And then let's talk about what did this mean? So anybody can go and, and maybe it's a good point to kind of pause the podcast and go listen to David's clip about MEDDIC. And that's M-E-D-D-P-I-C-C. It's an acronym. So maybe go listen to… actually, you know what we're gonna do? I'm gonna insert it right here. So I'm gonna have my audio editor insert having David walk through the MEDDIC process so that you've got that context.

15:50 Dalai Cote: The other piece of that is, you know, once we're actually in the deal cycle, using a methodology called MEDDIC. And, you know, MEDDIC is spelled M-E-D-D-P-I-C-C. The M stands for metrics. So metrics are essentially your business case. So have you spoken to someone and quantified the challenge they're having? Not that they have a pain, but what the pain actually means to their business. I am a firm believer that everyone that works at an organization either generates revenue, enables someone else to generate revenue, or somebody there protects revenue. So for me, what I'm trying to do is quantify, since I deal in talent acquisition people strategy, I'm trying to understand, you know, those types of, you know, positions and how people fit into those buckets and how those buckets impact the business. I think regardless of what you're selling, if you're selling a solution to a problem, you know, there's some downstream implication that problem is having, and it can often be quantified to a number if you ask the right questions. And the whole idea within the M in metrics and business case within MEDDIC is, have we put our finger on what that business case is and what those metrics are and how we can impact the organization? If you haven't, that's a, that's a gap within, you know, what I consider my sales process. The next one is the E, which stands for economic buyer. That's your veto. Have you identified that person? Are you meeting with that person? Have you identified the personal and professional wins for that person? Are you completely aligned with that person on the business case and all the metrics and all the end results that your solution will have? If you haven't, if you don't know who's actually signing the agreement and you haven't identified, you know, all of those things, That to me is a gap in the sales process. The next one is what their decision process is. So who are they evaluating? How many people are they evaluating? How long is the evaluation gonna take place? Who all's involved in that evaluation? You know, it's, it's all the things, it's every piece that the client's process is dictating that you need to find out. And again, if you don't know it, it's a gap. Next one's the other D in there is decision criteria. This to me is essentially a client's wishlist. What are they, what are they really looking for feature functionality from a solution? And, you know, how well does your solution align to that? Next one is the paper process. This is super important when you get into the prospect or the proposal contracting and also the commit stage within your business where you're doing your forecast. Do you actually know who's signing, when they're signing, the steps in their legal process? You know, do you know if that person is on vacation for the next week to 2 weeks? Believe it or not, happens all the time. I'm sure you've seen it. You know, have you really dialed in what that legal process is and how long the last solution that they signed that's similar to yours, how long that took and the roadblocks? And the challenges that it, that you may now need to overcome. And, you know, the red lines and the objections you're gonna get, and, you know, have procurement or the CFO or legal, you know, spoken to you yet and given you any of those objections? 'Cause you know what, they're gonna come at some point. So, you know, those are, those are ways that, you know, I, I, the paper process is really, really, really important when you come to, when it comes down to forecasting. If that's dialed in, you could tell within a day, you know, if an opportunity is gonna close or not. You know, have you really identified pain? That's, that's the I, identify pain. So that to me is, you know, outside of the business case, which is, you know, the end result, have you kind of identified the high-level reasons behind the change? Next one is, do you have a coach within the organization? And a coach is someone that will, you know, tell you, for lack of a better word, inside information about how well you're doing and provide you and give you access to people. And when things stall or things go slow or something unexpected happens, you know, they'll help you connect the dots and be real with you. And the last one is competition. That's the last C. Do you actually… do you know who you're competing against? Do you know your strengths and weaknesses versus them? And have you been able to articulate those to the client? All of those steps in that process that makes up MEDDIC have red, yellow, green, you know, attached to them. And to me, I'm not comfortable with a deal until they're all green. And when they're all green, I can… I probably have a 90-plus percent close ratio. And I would bet, you know, most of your listeners would as well because there's a lot there. That's pretty much the whole sales process there when it comes to things you need to have to be confident in an opportunity you're working.

20:47 Scott Ingram: Again, Dal, if you quantify your results and then talk about how did you apply MEDDIC?

20:51 Dalai Cote: Yeah, for sure. So top account executive at Loopio in 2019. So same year that the company became the 13th fastest growing tech company here in Canada. I hit 122% of plan carrying a higher quota than the majority of the team and doubled my sales dollars and my income over the year before. And doing that set a couple records for the company. So set the record for the most revenue ever booked in a single year in the company's history, set the record for biggest quarter ever, which was in Q4 2019, and also set the record for closing the biggest deal in company history, which was with a Fortune 500 client.

21:25 Scott Ingram: Awesome. Awesome, awesome. So now let's talk about your application of the MEDDIC process.

21:32 Dalai Cote: Absolutely. So this, I think, really comes back to having a system, right? And I think for me, a sales system has to have 2 components, and one of them is the art, and I can talk about that in a minute. But the second piece is really the science, and I think that term is something that David came up with. And what it really is is the strategy behind the deal, right? It's the why behind what you're doing and the overarching process. That's going to tie everything together. So for me, MEDDIC allows me to do 3 core things. So the first one is to stress test the deal, right? And validate the information that I need to get to a closed one or walk away really quickly. The second piece is plan, right? It gives me a really clear understanding of what the evaluation is going to look like and how we're actually going to come to a decision. And the third is forecasting. So when I can actually count on a deal coming in, and I think these are things that You know, these are all pieces that I really struggled with early on in my career. I'd have a great demo, but I didn't really know what happened next, right? I knew I needed a next step. Everyone, all sales managers, always told me, get a next step, get a next step. But I didn't actually know how to do that in a way that was going to provide value for the client. So MEDDIC really is a process of discovery and deal management, right? It allows you to ask the right questions at the right times so that you always know you're on the same team as your buyer, right? You always know what's happening in that deal. And it almost makes things like setting up and planning and figuring out what the evaluation is going to look like from here become pretty easy because you have a really clear sense of, you know, what's coming. And then when you're planning for a call, right, especially when you get later stages in the deal, you know the value you need to provide to your client, right? You know the purpose of that call, but what's the value that you're actually looking at getting as a seller? Like, where are the holes in your deal? Where are the things that you don't have full assurance on yet, right? And those are the ways… this is the best system to allow you easily to look at the entire sales process from start to finish. I almost think about MEDDIC as being, you know, overlaid onto the sales stages that you have at your company. And as you move through that deal, leveraging MEDDIC in different ways to gain the information that you need so that you're always in the know, so that you can move your deal and move your client through that deal and get to a successful outcome for the client as quickly as possible. And, you know, MEDDIC has allowed me to do that so effectively that over the last 8 quarters, I've actually hit Quota consistently, so obviously had a really great two years, but also had a consistent performance. It wasn't just one blowout quarter, which obviously no salesperson wants to have, right? And that's 100% attributed to Medpic for me.

23:59 Scott Ingram: Beautiful, beautiful. Let's go back to the beginning and just kind of talk about origin story and how you ended up in sales in the first place.

24:07 Dalai Cote: Yeah, for sure. So I'm from a family of entrepreneurs. Like growing up, I actually spent a lot of time helping out at the family businesses, and these were small businesses, right? My parents owned a toy store, and it was this two-story. Building, and on the main floor was the store. And upstairs, my dad, who is a lawyer by trade, had his own private practice. And in the back of the store, my mom, who's trained in theater, had her own drama and performing arts studio. So from a pretty young age, after school, I would, you know, walk over and help out at the cash register. And I spent some of the summers working for my dad as assistant, like filing and stuff like that at the firm. So I was pretty exposed to this idea of entrepreneurship really, really early on. And then I went off to university. And I met a group of guys that were living on my floor in residence, and they were in the process of starting this lifestyle brand selling t-shirts and sweaters. And I just wanted to be part of it. So I convinced them to let me join, and we built up this brand around our school spirit and being a college student. It was a ton of fun. We asked a lot of local DJs to wear our stuff when they were playing at student bars and sold it to our friends. But it really took off when Mac Miller, the late hip-hop artist, actually came to play on our campus. One of the guys in our group, he somehow found his tour bus and convinced him to actually wear our stuff on stage. And from there it really took off. Like literally, Scott, everyone on campus was wearing it. I still see photos from college, like from people from college, and they're still wearing stuff in photos. It was really, really cool. So by the time I graduated, I had a really clear goal of starting my own business. And, you know, I had a lot of student loan debt, so I thought, okay, what's the quickest way to earn good money while also learning a skill that's going to be useful to me one day when I actually go out and do something on my own. And that led me to sales. And I think having been around entrepreneurs, it led me to startups just naturally. And I started at a startup here in Toronto called Uberflip, and I guess the rest is history.

25:53 Scott Ingram: Crazy, crazy, crazy. Is there anything that you would do differently just from a career perspective, knowing what you know now and having worked in a couple of different sales roles?

26:02 Dalai Cote: I don't think I have any regrets per se. Like, I think I've been incredibly lucky to work for, you really great companies. One piece of advice though that I often give to people just starting out is don't try to jump up too fast. You know, it's really easy to find another company that's going to give you more money or a better title, but what matters most starting out is picking a good leader, right? Finding the right leader, making sure they're going to invest in your success, they're going to advocate for you and really help you grow and learn. And I think the only mistakes that I've ever made have been moving away from really great leaders too early. When there were still things to learn for a, you know, a shinier title or maybe for career progression. Those things will come. What really matters early on is building a good foundation. And the best way to do that is to have someone that's going to invest in you, right? And really, really help you grow into that, that role that I promise you will come if you have the right foundation.

26:54 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that's awesome. Do you have any tips for finding that? I think it's easier to see once you're in it, right? And you're working for a great leader. But what do you think about But what can you do on the front end to make sure that you're finding that person to go to work for?

27:08 Dalai Cote: Yeah. You know, it's funny. And it's something that I actually ask myself a lot and something that I spend a lot of time doing when I'm considering any career opportunity. Now, I think there's a few things that you can do. So number one is look at people that, that you find impressive, right? Whether that is, you know, the experience they've had, the companies that they've worked at, or even on things like podcasts, like David Weiss, fantastic leader. I literally just reached out to him. I reached out to him on LinkedIn and said, hey, you know, this is the impact you've had on me. I'd love to talk to you about X, Y. And we've set up calls and now we actually do a weekly call and we've become, you know, close friends and he's starting to become a mentor for me through that process. So I would 100% just like, just recommend go out there, talk to people, sit down with them, try to get to know them and try and do this before you're actually looking for a job, right? Because that's how you're really going to be able to get a sense of what their leadership style is like. Like, you know, who do they work well with? Things like that. Number 2 is I think you have to interview the leadership and the companies that you're working at, right? You really have to take control of that interview the same way you would a sales process. And you need to figure out like, what are the types of things that I'm looking for in a good leader? Ask questions, you know, like, how do you actually invest in your team? Right? Like, what does leadership mean to you? How do you run your one-on-ones? A question I like asking is, you know, looking at me now and knowing me from this process, what's something that you would right away want to mentor me on, or that you would want to provide guidance on? Like, where do you see the areas that I need to improve in most? And get a sense of, you know, how they think about you and how they think about their team. But it's hard, it really is, right? And I think, you know, when you're in an interview process and you're trying to find the right fit and you're really eager to get a job, just take a step back for a sec and just remember that as soon as you're in that role, right, it's really going to be important that you've decided to work for the right person. And spend that time doing that discovery and qualifying the opportunities the exact same way you would your sales process.

28:56 Scott Ingram: Man, great, great stuff. And now I'm curious because what we haven't said yet is that you parted ways with Loopio early this year. So what's next for you? How are you thinking about your next step?

29:07 Dalai Cote: Yeah, so I did. And it's funny, one of the things I was really looking at doing at the starting of this year is some travel and we're recording this and it's under COVID-19. We're all under lockdown right now and I'm recording this up in Canada. So it's the same as you folks down in the US. So that obviously got kiboshed a little bit, but for me, I've been at really, really small, exciting startups for my whole career. I've learned so much, and I think there's, you know, there's a lot of challenges working really small, but there's also a lot of opportunity, and you get exposed to so many challenges and so many problems. I couldn't recommend it more to anyone that's looking to start out their career. What I'm looking for next is to go somewhere that is a little bit bigger. I'm really looking at leadership, right? I'm looking at… there's a number of companies that are on my radar and leaders that I've been, you know, speaking with and talking to about, you know, is this going to be the right next step for me? And I don't think that's ever going to go away, Scott. Like, I don't think there's ever going to be a point in my career where leadership isn't one of the most important things, if not the most important thing that I look at when considering an opportunity.

30:05 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Awesome. Do you have a favorite sales story? I'm thinking like deal level here, right? So was there a deal maybe you won, maybe you lost, and you just learned a lot from the process that sticks out for you?

30:16 Dalai Cote: Yeah, absolutely. So the favorite Sales story that I have is actually a deal. It closed, and it's a favorite deal for a few reasons. So number one, I think it was the most challenging deal that I've ever worked by far. It was the biggest deal I've closed and is still the biggest deal in Loopio's history. So the client was a Fortune 500 company. I was selling it to the head of sales who oversaw a sales organization of about 500 different reps. And one of the challenges we faced in selling to them is that we were lacking a couple of features that were important to them, and we were actually priced higher than most of our competitors. So seemingly not in a great position. To win the deal. But I uncovered a few things really early on. So I uncovered that the solution was going to touch, you know, all 500 people that reported indirectly up to my champion, and it was going to fundamentally shift the way that they operate. I also uncovered they were in the process of digital transformation and were creating centers of excellence internally, and there was a lot of pressure to get this right. And I really got this sense that my champion was looking for a partner, not a vendor, right? So my entire approach became focused on driving home the idea and the importance of partnership. We engaged executive leadership from our customer success teams and our support teams early on and framed the initiative around building an RFP center of excellence, right? It wasn't about purchasing our product, it was about helping them build out this function that they wanted to build within the business. And this really shifted the conversation away from features and focused it on the objective, right, of transformation. And it was a huge differentiator against our competitors. It also gave us access to a number of key stakeholders behind the scenes. And if we revisit that point, I'm sure we will around partnership and you know how I look at it from an organizational level. It really allowed us to get access to people that we probably would not have otherwise, and that our competitors certainly did not have access to. So we had a whole team internally that were really selling and advocating for Loopio that were literally emailing my champion saying, you know, hey, when are we going to get access? When are we going live? And that was really, really helpful. The last thing that I'll say that we did here that was a really big learning for me, and that I think certainly helped us. Win this deal out is that we uncovered that it took 18 months for them to purchase the last piece of software that they had bought. And that's not, you know, hugely uncommon for, you know, large complex deals in the enterprise, but I wanted this deal a lot sooner. So to overcome this, we began onboarding their team during procurement, like the early stages of procurement. We got a lot of the technical stuff done, and this was actually pretty easy for us to do because we had already made those relationships, right? Those relationships were happening behind the scenes. And we created a target go-live date 60 days out from when we entered contracting, right? And this built up an incredibly compelling event for them, right, for our champions to push hard on legal and security, and gave us a ton of leverage during pricing negotiations. And the outcome was we won the deal, we got ink on paper 5 months from the first demo, and it was the biggest deal in the company's history.

33:03 Scott Ingram: That's a great, great story. So you've talked a lot about kind of the individual champion alignment, but you've hinted at the organizational alignment. What is that? How are you thinking about that? What's the process there?

33:14 Dalai Cote: Yeah, no, great, great question. So I think that, you know, modern buyers today are faced with more information and more choices than they ever have been before. Right. They're more empowered, which is really great, but they're also overwhelmed with so many options and competing priorities for their budget. And it's made buying hard. Right. I don't blame them. It's, you know, very few companies truly differentiate on product now. I think SaaS products especially are so easy to build and deploy that if a market has serious demand, it's going to quickly become flooded with competitors. And your competitors might not be as good good, right? But if the features appear similar on a demo and the marketing sounds the same, it's really hard for buyers to pick the right solution. And what they're going to do naturally is try and commoditize the options that are in front of them and make a decision on price if there isn't a very clear differentiator on value, right? Or if it becomes too complicated, Scott, they just won't make a decision, right? How many times have you heard organizations saying that the status quo has now become their biggest competitor? So what I focus on doing to actually build up organizational partnership is really building out value that's extrinsic to the product and then focusing on team selling as well. And I can talk about a couple key things that I do with both of those points that help us position ourselves really as a partner versus just another vendor, which is a lot easier to commoditize.

34:28 Scott Ingram: Yeah, man, keep going.

34:29 Dalai Cote: Absolutely. Okay, so first thing I do to tackle this challenge is, like I said, highlighting value that's unique to your offering, but that's also extrinsic. To the product. And this is actually not something that's new at all, right? At the core, it's challenger, right? You're disrupting your prospect's way of thinking to consider a new perspective that you're uniquely positioned to solve. But usually I find challenger and that approach is done in relation to your product. But what I actually do is I'll go a step further, right? And I'll challenge the buyer on the way that they think about the relationship between them and their vendor. I'll teach them about the specific processes and resources and expertise that are available to our clients, and I paint a very clear picture of what partnership looks like. And I'll do this very early on in the sales cycle. And then what I'll do is I'll let them experience it firsthand. And this is where the team selling piece comes in, right? I'll actually start bringing in stakeholders internally from my team and not just executives, right? I love leveraging executives, especially when you wanna match like the folks that you're speaking to, but I also engage the actual individuals who are gonna be supporting their success post-sale, right? I wanna build a relationship there. And the goal of these conversations is always focused on the overall outcome of what we're trying to achieve and providing value outside of the product, right? So I'm not talking about solutions engineers or solutions consultants. I'm talking about people that can actually talk about things like process change and best practices and insight into what peers are doing to solve these same challenges, right? That RFP Center of Excellence example that I gave earlier that are totally external to the product. And the advice is so incredibly valuable to your buyers, right? It creates differentiation. From the competitors that's a lot harder to copy. It helps build confidence in your organization, right? Because now they actually start feeling like you're actually gonna be able to deliver on what you're promising, which is so important, right? Especially in larger deals when there's a lot at stake. But Scott, it also does one last thing, and this thing is really subtle, but I find it to be incredibly important. Multithreading a deal on your side, right? It helps build a moat around your deal. After all of this, if the client still chooses to go in another direction, they don't just have to let Dal down as the sales guy, right? They're letting down an entire team that is excited about the partnership, that's been investing in their success, and that they've built relationships with. And that's a lot harder to do.

36:40 Scott Ingram: Yeah, man. So, so good. I mean, I'm having all kinds of flashbacks because in so many ways, I mean, this is the way that, shoot, I have sold in my current deal where it's professional services, right? At the end of the day, I'm selling the skill set of people. So the earlier that I can help my client experience just how smart and useful those individuals are. And then, you know, in the SaaS world, when I was at Bazaarvoice and when I was at Eloqua, both had just these extraordinary customer success organizations. Like, it's one thing to talk about those things, but again, to your point in commoditizing, it sounds the same. Like, I'm going to talk about it the same way that my competitor is, but it's a whole different thing to connect those dots and allow them to actually experience it. And it's amazing how powerful it is to have people who are often saying the same things, but when it's coming out of the mouth of a non-salesperson, I think in some ways it carries more weight. So we just have to sort of recognize that and say, okay, cool, let me set up somebody else in the organization to emphasize these points and to show off their capabilities and their experience and the stories that we have with other customers who have been successful in these ways. It's magical.

37:53 Dalai Cote: I couldn't agree more. And I think you brought up a really interesting point that everyone talks about it, right? And that was the thing that I struggled with is because I had some success initially when I started talking talking a lot about it, but so are my competitors, right? So is everyone else. They're always saying we've got a great customer success team and look at our G2 Crowd reviews, but it's very different when it's real world, when they're actually living it. And I think, Scott, you'll know you're heading down the right path when your prospects start pinging those stakeholders that you've brought in directly, right? Seeking their advice on all sorts of other things, saying, hey, you know, we're dealing with this process change, it's a little bit external to your product, but how do your other customers deal with this? And those are the types of conversations that, you know, ping, ping, ping, you've got value. And that's so much harder to copy. Exactly, exactly.

38:32 Scott Ingram: Awesome. So, I mean, you've done a lot in the last 2 years, had a ton of success. What are you most proud of?

38:38 Dalai Cote: I think it comes back to the deal that I talked about a little bit earlier with that Fortune 500 company. You know, of course, really proud to close it. But I think the thing that makes me most proud when I look back on all my accomplishments was actually the fact that when we wrapped up the deal, the champion who I mentioned, he led a team of about 500 salespeople. And he was someone who, you know, I really looked up to and I really respected as a sales leader. He thought enough about the experience that I had delivered to him that he actually reached out to my CRO and my director and told them how impressed he was with the sales experience and how he felt compelled to reach out as another sales leader. And he let them know that this was the actual best sales process that he had ever been a part of. And he agreed to come speak at our sales kickoff the next quarter. And I actually led that conversation on stage, and he talked a lot about the things that we did in the sales process. To help differentiate, but also to help build up that idea of partnership. And he actually used that line that he said, I buy from partners, not from vendors, on stage. So I stole it from him, but now it's exactly the way that he was thinking about it. He just hadn't said it earlier on. So for me, I mean, you know, going through is something that challenged me in so many ways professionally, but also knowing that, you know, I delivered an outstanding experience through that. Yeah, it was, it was really awesome.

39:51 Scott Ingram: That's huge. That's so awesome. Awesome. So now we're at the highest of the high. What's the lowest of the low? What's the biggest challenge you've had to face or the time where you were really struggling the most?

40:02 Dalai Cote: I think there's a lot of challenges that are just, you know, innate when you're working in startup environments. I think you're struggling with very few resources. You're building a lot of stuff from scratch. You know, early stage, you probably don't have a great sales enablement team or even a sales enablement team at all, right? You probably don't have sales engineering, you know, maybe not even case studies. And I think where I struggled the most was when I was at League, and that was my first, you know, job in a closing role. I'd come out of, you know, rockstar, I guess, career as an SDR before that. I was always number 1, you know, quarter over quarter. And for me, it really was hard to be able to learn the actual function of selling while also being in an environment where things were changing so quickly. But at the same time, like, once you actually build up that core and that foundation, startup environments are so much fun, right? You have the ability to really impact the positioning, the product roadmap, and help build out the sales process. And I've learned so much through that process. So again, you know, to your earlier question, like, I don't have any regrets about it, but it certainly was where I struggled, I think, the most. And this comes back to the advice that you asked earlier, Scott, right? Like, make sure you're working for the people that make sense for you to work for at the stage in your career that you're in. That probably wasn't the right fit for someone that was super green, right? Really didn't have any process or any actual closing experience to go in somewhere where No, they were quite straight up, like, we're not going to be able to give you that same kind of coaching or training that you would probably have if you were at a bigger company. And that company is now doing amazing, and they've probably built out all of those functions, and it's probably a very different environment. But when I was there so early on, it was, you know, few resources, and you're really at it alone, which can be tough if it's your, your first foray in sales.

41:40 Scott Ingram: Well, let's go deeper on that, and maybe it's the same answer, but maybe it's a little bit different. I mean, what guidance would you give to somebody, or even to yourself, working to make that transition from a predominantly prospecting role to a predominantly closing or, you know, full-cycle type of role?

41:55 Dalai Cote: I think this is such a hot topic. You know, I've seen so many things being posted on LinkedIn about this recently, and I know that every SDR is probably thinking, you know, when's the right time to make that switch? I've also seen that it seems like the average tenure of an SDR has increased, and my advice to you is that's okay, right? You're in a position where you're still learning and you're still being challenged, Stay in that position until the business moves you up into an account executive role. Now, there are some companies that don't ever make that movement, and I think that's really unfortunate to see. But the easiest thing to do to find success is to have the SDR to AE transition at the same company because you already understand, you know, high level of value prop. You have a decent understanding of the product, and you also have a decent understanding of the types of buyers that you're going to be reaching out to. So a lot of the learning that you have to do that's extrinsic to the actual role of being a seller is already done for you, right? What you're really going to focus on is going deeper on stuff like product, but also learning a lot of the foundational stuff that's going to make you, you know, more successful in sales. And that was one of the mistakes I think that I made was that I was going into not only a completely new role, but I was going into a completely new industry. I went from selling software to selling essentially insurance and having to learn, you know, about a really complicated set of products. At the same time as I was trying to level up. So biggest piece of advice is if you can, if it makes sense to do so, try and make that switch at the same place. You don't have to, but if you don't, make sure that you're gonna ask in the interview process, right? Like, what are you gonna do to ensure that I'm successful, understanding that I'm coming in at this with no closing experience, right? And don't feel like that's gonna, you know, put you at a disservice. They already know that, right, when you're interviewing. But get a sense of like how they're gonna support that transition. And talk to people internally there that have done that, right? Ask to be like, hey, I want to talk to a couple of reps that have done that and what they recommend and really get a sense from them of what's worked and whether or not they got the support that you think you're going to need at that specific company.

43:49 Scott Ingram: And it's interesting because I've been… I mean, if you've been listening to the show for any amount of time, I've been asking these questions and thinking about this a lot. What do you think is the right amount of time or the right range of time to be in that SDR role before you're really ready to make that AE transition?

44:04 Dalai Cote: I think it depends on how involved in the sales process you are as an SDR. So there are some organizations where, you know, you're purely just cold calling, and as soon as you set something up, you might pass that over to an account executive or to someone else in that role. There are other organizations where you might actually do the first, you know, not only first discovery call, but maybe the first couple calls. So I think it really depends on, you know, the level of depth and, you know, exposure to deals that you're actually having. I think as a general rule, you want to spend at least, at the very least, 1 year, but I think up to, you know, a year and a half is probably… a year and a half is probably the point where you've actually started to master that role. And you must have success at least for, you know, been in the near top, if not the top performer, for at least 2 or 3 quarters leading up to that point to really get a sense of what success feels like, to really understand the motions. And I recommend to any SDR, Even if you're, you know, 2 or 3 months in, as soon as it starts clicking, as soon as you actually start, you know, feeling kind of comfortable on the phone and you're booking meetings, go shadow account executives. I did this really early on and it was so incredibly helpful. And shadow the entire deal. And if you book a great op, shadow it every single call all the way to the end, make up those extra cold calls after 5:00 PM, right? Send those follow-ups at another time, because that's going to give you so much real-world examples of how to actually go through the motions. That'll be really, really helpful. And then ask questions, right? And when you get off one of these calls, you should have a list of like 40 questions, right? Because this is all new to you. And go to them and ask, why did you say this? How come you didn't say this? Or what are you thinking of doing as a next step? Because guess what? When you become an AE, that's exactly the same stuff you're gonna do to your colleagues when you're starting out in that role.

45:41 Scott Ingram: Nice. So good. Let's pivot and talk about just the routines and habits and all of that stuff. I know you know the recipe for this, so just kind of walk us through the day in the life?

45:52 Dalai Cote: Yeah, for sure. So habits or routines that I'm a really big fan of and that have certainly contributed, I think, to that idea of making success part of your identity is, you know, 1% improvements each day. So I read every single day and I try and read stuff that's going to be specific to sales, but I also like reading stuff that's on totally different topics as well. And I think that's going to give you a really good breadth of learning and understanding. I'm also a big fan of podcasts, right? Obviously. So I've got a couple of favorites there. And another key habit for me is exercise. I can't stress it enough how important physical and mental health is if you're going to be in a role like sales, which is challenging and it can be really, really stressful. I think that the last thing I'd say here, a habit or routine that, you know, has been, you know, really powerful for me, and it's something that I actually picked up fairly recently, is what I would call an attitude of gratitude. I think it's so easy to complain and find fault these days, and it's so much harder to actually focus on being positive and focused on the good that happened in your day. And this is actually something that I learned from Ralph Barsi. He leads the sales team at Tray.io and was previously at ServiceNow and led the sales team there for a number of years. But he just exudes this powerful sense of just happiness and positivity. He's like the sunlight that just comes into the room wherever he is. And that's made me actually a lot better at my job. I spend time every night reflecting on the good that's happened that day, finding things that I'm grateful for. And I find I wake up happier. I find I'm, you know, I'm I'm much probably funner to talk to, to my clients and things like that. And I can't recommend that enough. And it's so easy, Scott, to go the other direction. It's actually really hard to be grateful all the time, but it's so core, I think, to living a happy and a successful life.

47:27 Scott Ingram: Yeah, 100%. So I want to go deeper on all of that. So as far as the structure of a typical day, I mean, give us the blow-by-blow from the time your alarm clock goes off until the time your head hits the pillow.

47:39 Dalai Cote: Yeah, absolutely. So I am not a morning person, and Scott, I know you are, and it seems like every high-performing individual seems to be, but I'm just not a human for at least an hour and a half after I wake up. So my mornings probably don't start as early as they probably should. I'm usually up around 7:00 AM, but that is only because my partner is the biggest morning person I've ever met. And she's always up at the crack of dawn. So by 7:00, she's already, you know, well into her day. And by then I'm up and at it as well. I like getting out of the house quickly. I like getting into the office. And I think that motion of just getting up, you know, getting ready to go and getting out really allows me to start that process of waking up and becoming a human. My mornings usually between, you know, whenever I get into the office to 9:00 AM, is going to be usually focused on the key things that have happened since I left the office or since I went to bed. So emails that came in or things that I need to get to right away. I have a team, or I had a team of SDRs that would be booking some of my meetings for me. So I liked to keep my schedule as open as possible to allow them to slot in meetings at times that were, you know, as convenient and as accommodating to clients and really to reduce the time from discovery call to demo. There were certain times that I booked, like I liked booking time in the mornings right before 9:00 AM just to actually focus on follow-up. Follow-ups and things like that. I also always blocked the afternoon if I could on Fridays to really start setting goals and planning for the next week that was ahead. But during the day, like from 9 to 5 or 9 to 6 or whatever the time is where clients are actually probably going to be scheduling calls, I like leaving that for those calls as much as I possibly could. Admin stuff and stuff like that, for me, that's always going to be in the evening. I actually find I'm most productive then anyways. So follow-ups and preparing for the next day. Always gonna probably be after 6. And then I use some time in the mornings, either when I get right into the office or some time in the evenings for things like reading. I also try and get exercise in every single day as well, and that is actually where I listen to podcasts. So I'm lucky I live right downtown Toronto and really in the area where all of the startups seem to be, so I've never walked for longer than 10 minutes to work. So the gym is probably the biggest place that I actually have to actually listen to things like podcasts, and that's where those fit in.

49:41 Scott Ingram: Gotcha. So all of us morning people, we tend to have these morning routines. For you, it seems it's a little bit more survival and waking up is… do you have an evening routine?

49:49 Dalai Cote: So yeah, the morning routine is very much just focused around caffeine and the evening routine is, this is really me time, right? And this is where I want to be able to read at least for half an hour every evening. I listen to the news a lot and I watch the news. So for me, like being able to like after dinner actually sit down and see what's going on in the world is really important to me. I'm a huge fan of the news. Fan of politics, so I get my fix there. And like in the evenings, I also like spending time just with the family. Like for me, I like to have a little bit of time where you can shut off, put the phone away, things like that, and just recharge.

50:19 Scott Ingram: Nice. From a reading perspective, I mean, in the last, say, 2 years, I mean, as you've been working through this personal transformation, what have been the 2 or 3 most impactful books that you've read?

50:30 Dalai Cote: So I think, and this is so cliché, but I think to this day, Challenger is still one of the most impactful books that I've read. And I would urge people that have read it, you know, Maybe five or six years ago because it was a requirement for a new job to pick it up again. I've read it a number of times now, probably four or five over the last year alone, and every single time I pick it up and I read it, I always find a new way to apply it to some new challenge that's coming up. So that's a really big one. Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss. I actually hadn't read it until probably five or six months ago, and that's all about negotiations. Probably been talked about a lot on this podcast. Chris Voss is a former FBI hostage negotiator. But I find it so important, not just for, you know, pricing negotiations and negotiating at the end stages of deals, but really around difficult conversations that can come up throughout a sales process internally with other colleagues or just in your life as well. And the other sales-related book that I would call out is Strategic Selling by Robert Miller and Stephen Heiman. I actually find a lot of the principles there work really nicely with MEDDIC. So once you're starting to implement MEDDIC, it's a cool book that you can get ideas from for how to actually validate each of the letters in that acronym.

51:34 Scott Ingram: Beautiful. And then let's do podcasts. And then I want to ask you about Friday afternoon. So what's in your must-listen-to list from a podcast perspective?

51:43 Dalai Cote: Yeah, absolutely. So of course, Sales Success Stories. I think that's probably my favorite sales podcast that's out there. And I'm not just saying that, Scott, because I'm on the show, but the other one is Reveal, the Revenue Leaders Podcast. And this is actually a relatively new podcast. Gong put it out pretty recently, and they typically just bring on sales leaders at companies that you've probably heard of that lead really big teams and have done some really exciting things and ask them a number of questions, you know, about, you know, what the teams are doing and their philosophy towards sales. And I think it's really interesting to get that perspective because they talk tactics, but they also talk strategic. One of my goals is to move into a leadership role. And, you know, I've got a goal of becoming a CRO one day. So getting a sense of how these leaders think early on has been really, really cool. The other thing that I love listening to is How I Built This by Guy Raz. I don't think you have to be interested in business to be a salesperson, but I think it helps. And I've been so fascinated by the way people run businesses and the way businesses have been run in startups. And I think just by virtue of being so involved in startups for the last several years, it's been really awesome just to hear the different stories. And they're, you know, they're so entertaining and they're so interesting. So another good recommendation. Yeah, for sure. For sure.

52:50 Scott Ingram: Now, this is probably backwards in terms of the way you should think about it, but it's It's like the sales success story for business, right? It's just fun to really get deep into the founding stories and the trials and tribulations of companies that you've probably done business with or, or know of, or, or maybe you don't. Uh, there's some really, really interesting stuff in there. I wanna go to your Friday afternoon. So you said that that's kind of your goal setting, planning, strategy time. What does that look like specifically?

53:14 Dalai Cote: So for me, it's, and it's always in the office, it's a combination of 2 things. So one is gonna be reflection, so looking at what actually happened over the past week. And one of the things that, you know, I did really early on when I, you know, committed to the identity of a successful person was committing to small incremental improvements every day. So it allows you to reflect over like, what are the things that you did from Monday to, you know, Friday at noon, the 1% change that you made every day across a number of different areas, and what's the result been there, right? And then it starts allowing you to start thinking about, okay, this coming week, what do I want to plan for? Like, what are the things that I want to do to make this week week a success. So I typically actually write these down in a notebook, and I've started recently using my phone, just the notes sections on my phone, to just jot down a couple points, to jot down a couple wins, really to remember that, hey, you know, success happens over a really long period of time, but those small incremental wins are a really great way to prove to yourself that you're actually a successful person. That identity that you've set as a successful person, well, it's true, and you're going to have to convince yourself with a number of small wins until you actually get that point. So for me, it's reflect and then plan. And it really just is me sitting down with Dal and it's just talking about and thinking about what's worked, what hasn't, and what do we want to do differently.

54:24 Scott Ingram: Awesome. Well, there was a really great quote in there, so I know we'll be digging that one out. From a mindset perspective, right, so I want to go a little bit deeper into this just idea of I'm going to be a successful person. Talk about that more and how you're managing both the mindset and the positivity and, and all these things that we've kind of touched on, but I want to go a little Yeah, yeah, sure.

54:44 Dalai Cote: So I think this comes back to something I said a little bit earlier, that it's so easy to be negative. And I think sales is something where, you know, you're going to have a lot of highs, but you're probably going to have more lows than you're going to have highs. And you're probably going to have more lows than most other professions out there. So the mindset that I've tried to create for myself is recognize that even though you're probably going to lose more deals than you actually win, right? If you have above a 50% win rate, I mean, kudos to you. That's fantastic. But that's going to mean that you're going to have to get okay and get comfortable with failure. That does not mean that you are a failure. And this concept of, you know, identifying as a successful person, I think it's so interesting because for me, you know, it's always been like, or at least it always had been, I want to be this, or I believe, or I hope, instead of being I am this. And when you actually identify as that type of person, the actions and the things that you need to do become a lot easier because you just ask yourself, like, I'm a successful person, would I do that? Is that what a successful person would do? And I've read recently, and this is a book that your listeners, I would 100% recommend. It's called Atomic Habits. It's by James Clear. And he actually talks about this idea of the 1% improvement every single day. And I must have heard this idea on a podcast or somewhere before because I just really recently read the book. But his whole concept is that you have to prove, like, once you set an identity, you have to prove it to yourself with consistent wins. And those small little goals of the 1% they're really helpful because they set you up for success in the sense that you start believing it, that you actually are that person. And guess what, Scott? By the end of the year, if you make a 1% improvement every single day, you'll be 37 times better, right? Because it compounds. But it also allows you day in and day out to feel like that successful person as well. So for me, I don't think that without, you know, having changed my identity but also setting up small realistic goals that I actually ever would have been able to hit the big, big goals that I have now and actually start identifying with the person that, you know, I've become today.

56:37 Scott Ingram: That's awesome. So much good stuff in there. So talk about the tools and apps that are kind of core to the way that you operate and whether that is from more of a sales tech stack perspective or even just a kind of a personal tech stack. What's fundamental or foundational to the way that you just generally operate?

56:55 Dalai Cote: Yeah, I think there's a ton and there's really 2 categories, right? One of them is going to be the core sales tools that, you know, I hate to say this, but probably couldn't live without anymore. And obviously that's going to be like CRM, Sales Navigator is really big for me, Zoom, and a data tool, something like DiscoverOrg. You know, those are the things that I'm, you know, going to really enable me to be as successful and as efficient as I can be. Some other ones that I've found and really, really like using are GoVideo by Vidyard. It's actually a free tool. I think they might've been a sponsor of yours. That's probably how I found them, but sending little snippets and videos to clients, even just as an introduction before you actually sit down with them. It's super awesome. I'm also a huge fan of direct mail. So, you know, good old-fashioned FedEx and things like that. But also there's apps and there's platforms out there like Sendoso and Sugarwish, and even the Starbucks app where you can send gift cards via email have allowed me to differentiate myself a little bit in terms of my outreach through that. Personal apps, I get most of my news just directly through news apps. So like New York Times, the Bloomberg app, and Globe and Mail, which is a big publication here here in Canada. I also use social media, Instagram being my favorite, and LinkedIn as well. Like, I'm a huge fan of the LinkedIn newsfeed. I spend a lot of time there, and I think that's a great, you know, bouncing board to get into a lot of really, really great content. And the last one is Reddit. I probably spend too much time on Reddit than I should, but there's a lot of really cool communities there where you can, you know, learn a lot from people that are really passionate about a lot of the same things that you might be.

58:19 Scott Ingram: Good stuff. Now, I feel like I know what the answers to this are going to be, just given where the conversation has been, but I want asked explicitly about it, and, and that is, do you subscribe to a particular sales philosophy?

58:31 Dalai Cote: Yeah, absolutely. I think at the very, very core, I'm a challenger. I think there's no way around it. I really don't get uncomfortable from contentious or difficult conversations. I actually, Scott, I grew up in a household where we were really encouraged to be passionate and/or advocate for what we believed in. So I thrive in environments where, you know, candor isn't just a value, but it's really encouraged, and where there is objectivity and course and where the best ideas win. And I'm going to shout out someone else that did a phenomenal episode, you know, way back, probably 2017, that I really enjoyed was Kyle Gutzler. And he explained it so perfectly when he said he would, you know, come off calls with clients sometimes, and he would literally laugh when the deal ended up closing because of how much he had, you know, pushed back on the client. And I actually laughed when I heard that because I couldn't agree more. And I think the biggest red flag for me when you're selling something, especially especially something disruptive, is when the clients don't push back at all and are just complacent. I mean, to me, that just means they've tuned you out, right? Those are usually the deals that you're probably not going to win. But the ones where you do have contention and you really have to push people to find that new perspective, those are the buyers that are invested in finding the right solution, right? Those are the deals that you can win. And don't be afraid, right? Your customers are expecting you to challenge them. There's a lot of value in that. So I really subscribe to that style. And I think just the core of who I am has probably always been a bit of a challenger.

59:47 Scott Ingram: Nice. Now, how would you describe your style in the way that you apply challenger?

59:51 Dalai Cote: So we talked a little bit about like just now talking about applying it in conversations. But I think like so much of what I do really comes down to the whole idea of teach, tailor, and take control, right? Taking control of, you know, a sale. So super important. Taking control of your career. Extraordinarily important. Taking control of conversations where you're sitting down for an interview or something like that. I think teaching is also so powerful because if you just try and take control and you just try and challenge people, you're going to come across as kind of a dick, right? You're not going to come across as someone who's actually trying to actually shape someone's perspective or actually add value. So teaching is really important. And when we talked a little bit earlier about, you know, my sales philosophy that I have and having partnership and 2 different viewpoints of it, well, when you're partnering at the organizational level, you can't just challenge people and tell them that, you know, partnership is so important. Important, you have to talk about why it's important, and then you have to get them to feel it. And that's the whole teaching piece. You have to tailor it to what you know about the organization. Coming back to the Fortune 500 company that I spoke about a few times on this podcast today, you know, for us, understanding that partnership was really important, it was a combination of really good discovery. It was a combination of really understanding what they wanted, teaching our approach and why we viewed and how we viewed it to be important, and then tailoring that to what we knew about the client and the objectives that they had And I think that altogether can be used in business, it can be used in selling, and it really can be used in your life totally. And you got to do it the right way, right? Come from a place of respect and come from a place of value and really make sure people know that you might be pushing back on them, but you're doing it with their best interests at heart. And give people the ability to push back on you as well. And that's a conversation and it's so positive and so powerful. Yeah.

1:01:29 Scott Ingram: Now we talked about mindset, but what about the motivation piece? What about the drive piece? Like what keeps you going through all of this? Cause I mean, you called out like this job, it has more downs than it has ups a lot of times.

1:01:42 Dalai Cote: Yeah, it's so true. And I love that you called that out. And it's so funny. Like I, you know, I've been sharing stuff on LinkedIn recently. I've actually made it a goal of mine this year to start giving back as much as I can to the sales community. I think I've made so many withdrawals from the sales community. I want to start making some deposits, but a lot of people have reached out to me and they've said, you know, we hear a lot about success. We hear a lot about, you know, this podcast is really focused on success, But every single salesperson goes through really tough times, and most salespeople have gone through maybe jobs that, you know, weren't the right fit, or times where they were really in the hole and really, really struggling. So for me, there's 3 core things that motivate me, and I think that keep me, you know, positive and happy even through those downturns. And one of them is a sense of purpose. You know, I need to be passionate and excited that the solutions that I'm bringing to the table can really impact the organizations that I'm selling to. And Scott, I take what I do very seriously, right? So this isn't just a job for me. A big part of my self-worth comes from my career. I have really big career goals. So I look at, you know, in addition to leadership, I look at things like, you know, if I'm selling this product, will it be helpful? Will it drive value for the organization? And on the greater scheme of things, like, what is the mission? Like, what is this business actually trying to do to better the world? And if you can really get on board with that, those downturns and those times that are not not that fun are going to be worth it because you're still really believing in the overall goal of why you're doing this, and it's become really, really important. Another piece too is recognition. I love winning, but I probably hate losing even more. So I'm very motivated to see my name at the top of the leaderboard and being recognized for driving value within the business that I'm in. And I think this, you know, coupled with the identity of success was really helpful for me in the early days where I put a lot of work in, and I still do, like spending, you know, you're at the office till 10 PM, And doing that for day in, day out, learning and practicing, right? And just doing the motions that a lot of other people are not willing to put in. And that really came down for me for that drive to actually see my name continue to rise throughout the year. And then finally, money. I mean, I'm motivated by money. I've got big, you know, personal goals and money's a great piece of it as well.

1:03:41 Scott Ingram: So I want to make you choose between the money and the recognition. So the choice is, I guess you don't call it a W-2 in Canada, but whatever your, the end of year financial statement is that says this is how much money you made, would you rather have that be bigger and the recognition low or nonexistent, or would you rather like really be recognized and have an average-looking annual earnings statement?

1:04:03 Dalai Cote: That's such a tough question. And I think, you know, any future employer that's listening to this is probably going to hold this answer against me. But I think recognition, like, I really think that I would really struggle to stay productive and stay in a role where no matter what I did, there wasn't going to be a way to be recognized for it.

1:04:18 Scott Ingram: And I don't know if it's a personal flaw or if it's a good thing, but I'm just, I'm just hard Yeah, it's a question that I regret not having asked more consistently on this show, but something tells me that that is the much more common answer. I mean, for me, it absolutely is the case. And it's not just the recognition. I think of it as impact. I want the work that I'm doing to be making a difference, to have meaning. And of course, I want my W-2 to look great, right? Of course, we want to make great money. That's a big reason and driver for the work that we do, but at the end of the day, end of the day, I'm so much more driven by the accolades and the difference. I mean, and I think it stood out in the story that you told. I mean, I can't imagine a greater win than I ran this deal process so well. Yes, it was a giant deal and yes, I got a giant commission, but the guy who bought from me came on stage and talked about how awesome the process was. Like, that's the ultimate.

1:05:13 Dalai Cote: It's, it's so true. And you know what I think? Like, if you are doing things right, right, and you're getting recognition and you're driving impact and you're driving value, value, guess what? Money's going to follow, right? And that's, that's what I've always felt like. It's always seemed to happen that way, right? Because the way that we're, we're going to be compensated and motivated in sales is going to be driven from if you drive value and impact, you're probably going to make a good amount of money. So for me, it's always kind of been an afterthought just because I think of the way that the process follows. But yeah, no, Scott, I'm glad you shared that. I couldn't agree more. And, you know, I'm curious too, and I think you're probably right. I think most people that, you know, are top performers probably are motivated the exact same way as Yeah, I don't think it's universal.

1:05:51 Scott Ingram: There are definitely some people I know for sure that I have talked to where they're like, screw it, I don't need the recognition, just freaking pay me. But I, I do believe it's a bit of a minority. Well, since we're on the topic of beliefs, is there something you believe that the average sales professional would think is crazy?

1:06:09 Dalai Cote: Yeah, and I think this has been a hot topic in the past, but I think the idea of discovery fatigue, you know, I don't actually think that you need to do a ton of discovery. You don't need to ask a million discovery questions. To start delivering value. Don't get me wrong, I'm one of the most curious people and I ask, you know, a ton of questions during calls, but I think that, you know, front-loading them at the beginning is not gonna set you up for success, especially when you're selling to B and C level buyers in the enterprise. And, you know, going back to that story with that Fortune 500 company, I'm confident that if I had not, you know, taken such a customer-centric approach, I would not have closed that deal. And one of the ways that I did that was by getting to value as quickly as possible, leading with value in every single interaction. I actually had a promise to him that the most number of slides I would ever show on a call would be one to him. And there were a couple other calls we did with some of his colleagues that we obviously went through more, but it was like one slide challenge, right? It was… had to be impactful, it had to drive value. And he actually told me when he was up on stage, he said, you know, I actually hung up on one of your competitors because their process was so seller-centric. And this was in the first 10 minutes of that, that first call. So make some deposits, right? Provide some value before you make withdrawals.

1:07:18 Scott Ingram: Man, you called this out earlier and I didn't talk about it, but I feel like we use these decks and we use these presentations as a fricking crutch. And I don't know about you, but I don't ever want to see more slides. I don't ever want to see PowerPoint. I just, it's not, I hate it. I freaking hate it. Can we just have a conversation? Can we talk about What's relevant here? Can we talk about me? Right, like I'm so over presentations.

1:07:46 Dalai Cote: It's so true. It's so so true. And I'm blanking on the name of the movie that this was in. I know Tom Cruise is in the movie, but it's that scene where he's you know that sports agent and he's talking to his to one of his Jerry Maguire. He's like, "Show me the money." That's what that's what people want to see. They want to see the value. And I think so many buyers are sitting at the starting of these calls and they're having this internal. Like screaming match where they're like, show me the value, right? That's all that we want. And you know what, when you start showing the value, all of those questions that you need to ask, right, med pick is about questions, all of those will become really easy. Because buyers are going to become more forthcoming, they're going to be more open to actually sharing with you as well. And I think the deck is a crutch, I could not agree more. And I think the reason that it's still used so often is because it's become such a symbol of sales, right? When you think of selling, you think of a sales deck, and I don't know necessarily if every organization, if they need that, if that matches the way that their buyers want to buy from them. And don't get me wrong, there's probably a lot of people on your show that are selling really, really complex things or really trying to, you know, change the way that buyers think about the problems that they're having, and they might need one. Andy Raskin, I'm not sure if you've seen his stuff online, he talks a lot about the greatest sales decks that he's seen, using Zuora as a great example of it, and I love it. I think it's so packed with value that I would definitely use it in that situation. But ask yourself, right? Like, is this useful? Ask your clients, was this useful? If it's not, I won't use it again. And people will be forthcoming. And yeah, no, Scott, you hit the nail on the head.

1:09:08 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So 2 thoughts there. One is that I've really been experimenting with and having some pretty interesting early success with is the conversation I had earlier this year with Brandon Fluharty and the executive memo kind of concept. And that reminds me, he actually created an example version of that that I haven't yet shared. So, we'll put a link to that in the show notes, top1.fm/92. The other thing is that I've been thinking about and talking about here recently, you talked early, early on about the pattern interrupt. I feel like as soon as you start presenting off of a deck, you basically set up an environment where, okay, everybody go get in your role, right? Like, I'm now gonna put on my freaking sales guy hat. Hat, and you're gonna put on your skeptical prospect hat, and we're gonna act accordingly. And the outcomes of that are generally not good.

1:09:59 Dalai Cote: It's so true. And you know what probably happened before that, Scott, is we probably talked about the weather and how we'd actually been to a golf course or a national park near where they are. So we're going to talk about that, and people don't care about that. No one likes that. People want to get on the call and they want to say, okay, very quickly, is this going to provide my organization with value? If it's not, that's okay. You can part ways as friends. But if it is, they should be able to see that very, very early on. And guess what? I find that a lot of the rapport building that I do actually just happens during the conversation when you start delivering value, because they open up, people become human again. You're 2 business people that are trying to tackle this business challenge, this business problem together. And I have, you know, great conversations and build up so much rapport halfway through the call that I would never have been able to do right off the bat. Because guess what? We're both strangers, right? Why are we sitting here? Let's get to point. And once you've done that, then broken the hell out of that pattern, and you're going to start seeing your relationships with clients just totally, totally transform.

1:10:53 Scott Ingram: Yeah, totally, totally. So let's keep going on this. And I'll ask kind of the flip of the original question, which is, is there something that the average sales professional believes that you think is crazy?

1:11:04 Dalai Cote: So it's funny, I was actually going to talk, I think, a little bit about the sales decks here. I know this is a question that you seem to ask a lot on the podcast. I love the question. I think the way I'll go in this direction is going to be focused on pricing. And I'm going to give, I guess, a bit of a disclaimer before I say this. So I think that, you know, you certainly never want to, you know, have a deep conversation around pricing before you've proven out value and fit, right? You want to understand what's compelling someone to make a decision. You want to understand, you know, what their challenges are, and you want to connect that to some value that you can drive, even just, you know, to get a scope of what the project could look like. But I've spoken to a lot of reps that, you know, try and hold on to pricing for as long as possible. Throughout a sales cycle. And they do it because they want to be like crystal clear on, you know, every single aspect of what they've done in the deal. But buyers, right, we're buying, right? They're buying something. And big part of buying is the transaction of actually handing over cash at some point. They want to get a sense of, if I'm going to invest all of this time with you and try and figure out if this is going to fit, is this something that's even remotely in the realm of possibility? So I believe that, you know, it's good to be upfront, right? If we're talking about creating customer-centric sales processes, Be upfront about pricing. Talk about what it could look like. Don't do it at the beginning of your first call, but by the end of that first call, if those questions come up, be okay to give a range, right? Like, be okay to say, hey, this is what it could look like. Here's what I want to do to actually get in a place where we can really give you a crystal clear decision, because I know that pricing is important. It's certainly important to me every time I buy. I'm never going to go to a store and try on a shirt probably without looking at the price first, right? So for me, it's like, have that approach and, you know, they're not going to hold you to it. Things could change, and as long as you set that expectation, again, pattern breaking. Your buyers are going to feel a lot more at ease, and they're going to be a lot more willing to work with you.

1:12:47 Scott Ingram: Yeah, great stuff. So, from an advice perspective, what would you advise somebody that's just getting started in sales today? What would you tell them to do, to think about, to really build a great foundation for themselves?

1:13:00 Dalai Cote: Yeah, this is such a great question, and it's funny; it's very topical. I'm having a lot of these conversations now. I think just naturally from having put. Put myself out there a little bit more on the online sales community. So the number one thing that I say is surround yourself with A-players, right? You're really a product of your environment. The most important thing that you can do early on is work somewhere that's going to invest in your learning and development, but also somewhere where you're going to be able to learn from people that are really, really good at what they do. I'm a true believer, and I think I'm also an example of that sales can be learned. I don't think it's innate. So go seek out people that are top performers, right, in the organization, latch onto them, join their calls, follow their deals in Salesforce and on Gong. Like, I would literally do whatever I could early on for that person. I would go get them coffee, I would pick up their lunch, right? Really putting my ego aside just so I could be around these people. And people love that, right? They want to feel important. They want to feel like they're actually making a difference, and they will invest time. Most people will invest time with you there. So that's the number one thing that I could say is go find the people that are doing what you want to be doing. And try and emulate and learn what's working for as many of them as possible.

1:14:02 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that's about the perfect setup just in terms of what the why is on the Sales Success Summit. You know, it's funny, the content is great and super valuable, but it's such a small part of why the summit exists. The summit exists to do what you described, right? It creates that environment so you can really meaningfully connect with the people that are the best of the best and start to build those relationships. And it's not a point-in-time thing. Thing, right? I think an event done wrong, and if you look at the value or the half-life of the value of an event, for most events, it trails off. I mean, the half-life is 24 hours or 48 hours. So, a week afterwards, you're not carrying anything forward from that time that you just spent at the event. And I feel like I've been able to do a pretty solid job with the Sales Success Summit. There are conversations that to this day are going on from the first summit nearly 2 years ago. And those relationships that are built and the careers that have been built and trajectories that have changed because of of the positions that people have been able to get into and the learning that they've been able to apply. So, I mean, that is at the core of why we do this thing, because to me, it is, it's who you surround yourself with and spend time with and learn from. And are they really where you would hope to be?

1:15:18 Dalai Cote: And talk about value, right? I love that. I'm so excited about the summit. And I think, you know, Scott, like, I don't know if I would be where I am today had it not been for this community. And I'm saying that, you know, truthfully and honestly feel that. And I would encourage people, like, I think you bring up a great point. If you don't have those type of people that are willing to invest with you around where you are today, well, you're really lucky because you're living probably at the time when, you know, networking and being able to do these things is at its peak. Go talk to people, reach out to people, go to the Sales Success Summit, go to places like this where you can surround yourself. It's possible to do. I've done it. Everyone's doing it that's going to be successful. And those results will come. I promise you those results will come. Just surround yourself with those types of people. And you'll become that product of that environment.

1:15:57 Scott Ingram: Yeah, let's keep going with that. So what's the advice that you would give? And maybe again, I'm going to have you go back and talk to yourself in that in that first AE role where you were struggling. How do you get Dal at that point to make this turnaround and flip that switch and just change the game?

1:16:15 Dalai Cote: Yeah, it's such a great question, and I think a lot of it is the advice that I would give people that are just starting out. Right? It's go find those. People in the organization. There were people in that organization that were doing well, right? They had figured it out, and surround yourself with them and get them to invest a little bit of time with you. I think the other piece, and I think this is a little bit more applicable when you're a little bit further on in your career, but, you know, is start really focusing and asking yourself, you know, do you identify as a top performer? And it's okay if you don't, and it's okay because you don't have to, right? If your goal is to hit quota, then all the power to you. I love that. I think that's so fantastic. But if you're someone who's driven by the fact that, you know, that recognition that you need to be the number one, your self-worth is really being driven from that, ask yourself if you identify as that. And if you don't, well, change your identity, right? Start identifying as a top performer, as a successful person, and commit to that 1% growth every single day. Because until you do that, it's going to be really hard for the results to come, no matter how much effort and how much, you know, work you're putting in because you're not actually guiding your actions to the actual goals that you set. Great stuff.

1:17:19 Scott Ingram: Now, Dal, I know you have been a regular listener to the show, so I'm really interested in your perspective beyond the questions that I typically ask and the things that we get into. What would you want to know from the top sellers in other organizations?

1:17:33 Dalai Cote: So I think a couple of things that are top of mind for me right now. Number one is how to increase initial deal size. And doing that, like, again, based on value, right? Like, what are the things, what are the questions that I should be asking? What are the approaches that I should be taking to find ways to continue to enhance the value that we can deliver initially to that organization? Number 2 is how to reduce sales cycle length. And, you know, I've got a hunch here that it's being, you know, better at identifying compelling events, really the why now, and aligning what you're offering to that. But what are the things that I can do there? To create them, or at least find them that exist already, you know, naturally on the client side. Yeah.

1:18:11 Scott Ingram: And what's your answer to those? I mean, how have you been able to grow the deal early on and accelerate the process?

1:18:17 Dalai Cote: Yeah, absolutely. Great question. So for me, again, coming back to building partnership, I think the individual partnership piece, this is where it's so important. And there's, you know, we talked a little bit about this at the beginning of the call about building up that champion, leading with value. I think another way that you can do this is treating buyers like they're your boss, right? And the reason that this is really important, this distinction, is because you want to make it as easy as possible for them to buy from you. You want to remove any roadblocks, you want to make yourself available, you want to be responsive, and you want to make sure you can make them look good, right? And the reason that this is really important is because they will be a lot more comfortable putting you in front of other stakeholders internally if they know that you're going to be well prepared, if you're competent, you're credible, you their best interests at heart. And what that's going to end up doing is it will give you the ability now to actually network and speak to different people within the company to continue to dig on additional areas where, you know, pain can actually be. And if that's coupled with, you know, actually building up the champion from getting the value quickly, and they're forthcoming, and there's more people that are being involved in this, naturally, you're going to be able to find ways where, you know, you maybe haven't previously talked about, but that there's opportunities to provide value Well, let me ask you this because you had sent that in one of your notes too.

1:19:28 Scott Ingram: So if you're treating your champion like your boss, how do you treat your boss, Dal?

1:19:32 Dalai Cote: Like a champion.

1:19:36 Scott Ingram: Are you really gonna leave it at that?

1:19:40 Dalai Cote: So I think it really comes down to, you know, a lot of the same things that you're gonna be doing with your boss, right? It's making them look good. It's making yourself available. It's, you know, preparing for meetings. It's having that positive attitude and making it as easy as possible also to manage me, right? Like coming to them when you need help, setting out an agenda for a meeting, things like little things like that. Understanding that they have a very difficult, you know, task at hand. They've got a number of things, probably a much more complex role than you have. So making it as easy as possible to navigate through that relationship. Love it.

1:20:12 Scott Ingram: That's fantastic.

1:20:12 Dalai Cote: All right.

1:20:13 Scott Ingram: So we have made it to the end and I always like to try and make these as actionable as possible. We've covered so much great ground. This has been… this has really, really been good. I've enjoyed our conversation a lot. So what would you challenge the person listening to this to do right now over the course of the next 1 to 2 weeks to improve themselves and improve their results?

1:20:35 Dalai Cote: I think it's a good time to just think and kind of decide, you know, what type of person that you actually want to be. You know, if you're not a top performer and you don't really truthfully identify as one yet, but you want to be one, focus on changing your identity and start proving to yourself through that 1% increase in every aspect of the process that you can be better and trust that process, right? And the results really will follow. It begins with that mindset. If you believe it's possible, it's going to happen. So map out everything that you're doing today, right? Because you can be better in every single aspect of that sales process and find 1% increases that you want to make across it every single day. And then identify identify as that and continue to challenge yourself to live up to that identity that you've set. That was, you know, one of the most foundational things that I've done, and I think you'll be surprised how quickly you actually start identifying as that top performer, and that level of confidence is really going to exude from you. Your buyers are going to feel it, your boss is going to feel it, right? People around you are really going to feel it, and people like being around successful people. So spend some time thinking about how you actually identify, be really honest with yourself. And if it's… you're not identifying with the person that you want to become, well, you can change your identity at any point, right? That's something that you have the power to do. So go ahead and do it.

1:21:48 Scott Ingram: Dal, thank you. This has been so good, and I can't wait to see you in October.

1:21:53 Dalai Cote: Thanks so much, Scott. This has been fantastic. And one last thing that I'll leave with everyone is if there's anything that you want to learn more about, feel free to reach out to me. I'm super happy to chat. And Scott, thanks so much for having me. Thanks for listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast. To be sure you never miss an episode, and for an invitation to our Sales Success Community, powered by Influitive, subscribe to our newsletter at top1.fm.