83: Getting In The Strategic Zone with Chris McKenzie

0:08 Scott Ingram: You're listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast, where we deconstruct world-class sales performers to provide insights and strategies to help you improve. To learn more, visit us at top1.fm. Here's your host, Scott Ingram. This episode is sponsored by Outreach. You can check them out and get a free copy of their new book, Sales Engagement: How the World's Fastest Growing companies are modernizing sales through humanization at scale by clicking over to top1.fm/outreach. Today on the Sales Success Stories podcast, my guest is Chris McKenzie. Chris is currently the number one enterprise BDR at Zoom Video Communications and is based in Denver. Welcome to the show, Chris.

0:51 Chris McKenzie: Thanks, Scott. Really excited to be here.

0:52 Scott Ingram: Yeah, excited to talk with you. And let's dig in like we always do and just get to some immediate value by talking about the top 3 things that you believe have contributed most to your success as a BDR there.

1:03 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I would say that process is one of my, my top differentiating factors. You know, rather than blindly replicating a standard approach at any organization that I go into, you know, I like to use that as a guideline for my first few months to get up and running, but really focus on developing a process that plays to my strengths. And one of those strengths is leveraging data, which is my next factor. You know, I like to thoroughly exhaust all of the data resources at my disposal. You know, looking at like first-party intent data, third-party intent data, looking at relevant news outlets for potential trigger events, and really use this data to inform my outreach approach. So I'm only spending time, you know, cold calling. I like to call it warm calling at that point, high potential to convert prospects. And, you know, another factor that I think is really important for my success is collaborating with the other departments. So working with our ABM, account-based marketing program, data science, And the channel, trading introductions, just working with all of the resources at my disposal in terms of different departments and data they might have access to or any sort of information I can glean that's gonna help me create like a heat map or like a radar of where there is traction within my account portfolio and really dial in on specific lines of business or titles that are gonna be a lot more high potential to convert.

2:28 Scott Ingram: Nice. Let's dig into those last 2 just a little bit more in terms of maybe a specific example of the type of data that you might use or an example of how you collaborate with other departments to whether it's pulling that data or just leveraging. I don't know if that's a story or what that might look like.

2:45 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. Yeah, I can give you a couple examples. So one example for the data. So I mentioned first-party intent data and third-party intent data. Just a real quick overview of what those are. First-party intent data is information that you're going to have that's gonna track visitors to your website. So your company site, it's all of the data that you're aggregating kind of firsthand. And then third-party intent data is leveraging external networks and resources like TechTarget or Demandbase that are compiling data and information on their networks of people downloading content that's relevant to your solution or maybe a white paper for your solution. And I like to create a holistic picture of my account portfolio by leveraging both of those data sources as well as relevant news outlets and create a picture of where there's some acceleration or traction. So one thing that might be important to me would be to look at Demandbase and see how many visitors I've had from a certain domain. So say that Verizon were one of my accounts and somebody came in from a Verizon domain, you know, they're logged in through their work domain, it's gonna register as, you know, one visitor from Verizon. And looking at the traction or acceleration where it's, you know, an account has a 90% increase in visits to your website is really important in terms of, you know, identifying where there's a problem, where somebody might have a problem that your solution fits within your account base.

4:13 Scott Ingram: Nice. And the irony in that is the last SDR episode that I did was with the number one SDR at Demandbase. So everything comes kind of of full circle. So shout out to Vincent Matano. And, and if you're enjoying this, if you like this interview with Chris and you want to find another interview episode, that would be the one to go check out. Well, let's, let's put this in context then and, and talk about kind of the, the BDR role and, and what that looks like for you. I mean, just, just walk us through what, what is your role, what is your territory, what all are you working on?

4:43 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. So as a BDR, business development rep, you know, I'm, I'm responsible for the outreach, creating initial conversations. And, you know, the way that it's… it works at Zoom and I think most organizations is that it's, you know, you're paired up with a couple of account executives that have a territory, a specific territory, whether it's geographic or segment-based. So my… I work with 2 account executives that are out of New Jersey, and my segment is the enterprise segment. So the territory geographically is New York City, Connecticut, New Jersey, and then the segment is enterprise, which just means for our organization, it's 5,000 to 10,000 employees and up. You know, we have SMB, commercial, and majors make up mid-market, and then enterprise is going to be, you know, all of your, all of your really large, large organizations. So that's the way that the territory is divvied up. And my job is then to go in, you know, I have a list of all of the accounts within my AE's territories, and then I go in and formulate a strategy to, you know, create some meetings, some opportunities where we don't already have business. And, you know, that comes down to, like I mentioned before, you know, using data to really hone in on which accounts I wanna target. You know, I look at it as a funnel and the top of the funnel is, you know, before you're out there cold calling and putting a bunch of activity in, is I wanna first dial in where the highest potential, you know, opportunities are within my entire account portfolio. And I mean, the other factor to that is that your account executives may also have some sort of internal initiative, right? They might have an account that they really wanna land. Or they might already have traction with one account and they have specific initiatives for you to reach out to, you know, IT or HR at this specific account. So it's, you know, there's a lot of strategizing and working with your AE, and then there's a lot of, you know, processing data and trying to figure out where you should, you know, begin spending your time on the outreach. And, you know, in terms of outreach, it's pretty standard cold calling. We do email cadences through SalesLoft. I know a lot of people use Outreach, so you'd have sequences would be, you know, your analogy there. And yeah, you just kind of create a cadence, whether it's 2-touch, 5-touch, get out in front of the right people after you've identified where you want to be. And, you know, just kind of take it from there.

6:59 Scott Ingram: Now, are you measured based on the number of meetings that you're setting, or is it more aligned with opportunities or the volume of or value of opportunities that you're creating?

7:09 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, yeah, good question. So we are purely right now on a, on a quantum, a quantity-based quota. So there's not, we don't have the quality factor in right with the ARR, MRR. We're paid out based off of the number of opportunities that are getting to a certain stage within the sales process.

7:27 Scott Ingram: Perfect. Now, before we talk about Chris's results, let me tell you a bit more about Outreach, who has so generously supported this show and this episode. Ever feel like you can't really connect with prospects or have an organized workflow to get deals closed? Outreach is the number one sales engagement platform that streamlines effective playbooks for high-touch revenue organizations so they can focus their time, efforts, and resources on driving better customer engagement and repeatable success. Revenue teams choose Outreach because it's designed to fit the needs of every workflow, role, and team. It's dependable, secure, and scalable, and applies machine learning and AI to power better engagement and rep efficiency. You can check them out at top1.fm/outreach. Outreach to chat with them and receive a free copy of their new book, Sales Engagement: How the World's Fastest Growing Companies Are Modernizing Sales Through Humanization at Scale. All right, Chris, let's talk about the results that you've generated. What does it take to be the number one enterprise BDR at Zoom?

8:28 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I mean, you know, in terms of results and pipeline that I've generated for fiscal year '20, so this past year, it's… I've 10x the median pipeline generated across all segments and 4 times the average for the enterprise segment specifically. So whenever you're looking at the pipeline generated, it's pretty important to factor in which segment you're looking at because enterprise is obviously going to have larger deals, larger pipeline per unit. So yeah, so that number is 4x.

9:00 Scott Ingram: That's fantastic. Well, congrats on a great year. And why don't we talk just about Where did this all start for you? What's your origin story? How did you get into sales in the first place?

9:10 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. So as it is with a lot of people, you know, you kind of stumble into sales. I went to university, I went to school for petroleum engineering, and I actually dropped out my last year to pursue a job that opened up in a small town in West Virginia for software sales. It was a BDR role and there was nothing like it in the entire state. And I happened to know kind of what that meant. You know, it was a foot in the door into software sales, you know, the beginning of a path to a lucrative enterprise AE role that a lot of people covet. And yes, I dropped out of school, joined in on with this company called Auction Mobility that sells auction software. And, you know, within the first year, by the end of the first year, I was the top BDR, generated 2x closed revenue, and moved from West Virginia out to Denver with no real plan in mind besides, hey, there's a tech scene there. I want to find something bigger and better and leverage my experience to land a job at Zoom, you know, pre-IPO, which was, which was pretty fortuitous.

10:13 Scott Ingram: That's awesome. So was that all the right choice? I mean, to leave early and take these steps and to get into the place that you are now, and obviously you're having good success and I'm sure more opportunities will open up for you there at Zoom based on what you've done.

10:27 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, definitely. I mean, it's not something that I would recommend, stay in school, finish up, but in hindsight, it was the perfect choice for me. And it was a really, I guess, timing-sensitive situation in the sense that I got to Zoom before IPO, which was a really good time to be there. And it's an awesome experience to ride that wave with any company as they go from private to public. So had I waited and finished out my degree and graduated, I would've missed out on all of that and, you know, likely a, or potentially a once in a lifetime experience. So in hindsight, yeah, totally the right move, but, you know, was it necessarily the most responsible move at the time, not knowing where things would go? Probably not.

11:08 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I've done the IPO thing twice myself. It is, it is a fun ride to be sure. But, you know, one of the things that you created for yourself, I mean, you, you don't get those types of opportunities if you're, if you're not performing. And so, and I've been talking a lot lately about kind of intentionally managing your sales career and things like that. And one of the things I think is the most key factor is you've got to be performing in the role that you're in today. And you got off to a good start in that first role and were able to get to the top. What, what was that? I mean, was, was that approach any different than what you're doing here? Like, how were you able to be so successful so quickly in that first opportunity?

11:49 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, you know, the approach was definitely different, you know, because I got in there, I hadn't really done any cold calling, anything like that before. So it was really just kind of hacking my way through the first couple months, just figuring out how not to suck on the phones and get people to take meetings. But after that, I mean, I think the real commonality between my approach there and my approach at Zoom is that rather than just dialing and cold calling these, whatever popped up in my CRM, I took immediately to trying to develop a process. That would just optimize that and get me on the phone with people that are, number one, answering, and number two, they're more likely to have a problem that we solve. So that was a real common point. One specific approach that I used at my previous role and that I used for my first quarter at Zoom to really get off the ground is the software is… the market for the previous company's software and the market for Zoom is international. So I did something that no one else was doing, and I would work until 10 PM Eastern time because then I would have access to the Indian markets, to Southeast Asia, where number one, it's an underserved market, and number two, they have less cold callers. So people were answering the phones. They were in need of the product that I had, and it was a lot… I felt like the sales cycle was a lot quicker as well. So that was, you know, that was one thing that helped differentiate, you know, my success early on, I guess, is just reaching out to more people and, you know, finding people that no one else was reaching out to in the first place.

13:24 Scott Ingram: And that's really interesting. I mean, and was that above and beyond kind of stuff? I mean, that was just, hey, I'm gonna put in an extra 3, 4, 5 hours a day to get those extra repetitions in?

13:34 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean, it was, it's about the extra reps and about the, you know, those reps were being executed on a different market. So I always thought it was, I kind of viewed it as a, I don't know, my CRM is a gold mine. And whenever you sell an international product, the mine's always open. So I would, you could show up early like I did at Zoom for my first quarter. I would show up at 5:30 Eastern time, which is a really good time to be hitting Europe. So you can be dialing on Europe, South Africa, any of those markets within that time zone. And then it comes time for the East Coast to be answering. And then if you're working late at night, Now you have access to Hong Kong, Singapore, India. It was a really good way to just be able to maximize the potential there because if you believe in your product, then you know it's going to give you results. And if the mind's always open, you should be definitely hitting it whenever you can. I mean, whenever I was in my first role, there was a period of time where I was pretty crazy about it and I was working from 8 AM till 10 PM every day. Because I was just getting results, helping land Australia and New Zealand accounts, and then working Europe in the morning. It was really insane, but it was nice, number one, to be able to have access to all of the, a larger market, a larger addressable market, and to be having different conversations. Diversifying your talk track and getting different feedback, I think, always helps you hone in on your messaging for everybody that you're gonna talk to.

14:58 Scott Ingram: Man, that's brilliant, especially if you think about it. Given, given the higher connect rate, right? Given the higher conversation rate that you're having, I have to imagine that that 1 year of sales experience is really 3 years, you know, or at least 2, probably 2 to 3 years, just in terms of the quantity of conversations you're having. Again, it's the number of at-bats. You're going to be way, way further ahead of any traditional standard SDR that's just working an 8-hour day and having a standard number of conversations. And I guess the results show for that. You put up 4 times the results.

15:36 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I mean, that's… I feel like the way to quantify at-bats is, you know, it's not by the cold calls you make, but it's by the conversations you're having. So if you can create a process or, you know, implement a strategy where you are getting more people to answer the phone or, you know, even answer your emails, you know, the more conversations you have, I mean, that's the true at-bat. And And that's what I try to do with my process, you know, from working on international focus to leveraging data to find people that have problems and are more likely to answer the phone and, you know, respond to my emails and set something up. You know, it's, it's just a lot more at-bats and more at-bats for me means more at-bats for my AEs, which means more revenue for the company.

16:16 Scott Ingram: Man, that's, that's awesome. And I love that. I mean, you're really focused on the right thing. I mean, at the end of the day, it's, it's the conversations, the only thing that matters. I often laugh when I see these Oh, you know, my my job is to make eighty or a hundred dials a day. I'm like, if it's just dials, I can find a hundred people who will never answer the phone and call those hundred people real fast and be done with with my quote unquote metrics. But there's never gonna be any success there. That's pointless.

16:43 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, hundred percent. And honestly, that's that's kind of the disconnect I feel with a lot of with a lot of the metrics because I mean the cold call number, right? That's a metric that's It's more of a North Star. It's a guideline, but the reality is that the cold call doesn't mean anything. It's the conversations. And beyond that, it's the meetings that you're booking and then it's the meetings that are converting. So if you have a process that sort of, you know, I mean, it might not eliminate one of those factors, but I mean, if your process warms stuff up and you're having more conversations with less calls, you know, I feel like it's nice to be able to stand back and see when something else is working and it's not just, you know, hitting the phones you know, blindly hitting the phones because you can just dial, you know, whatever's next on your CRM. And like you said, you could hit 150 calls in a day, but it doesn't mean that you're going to get 150 conversations or even 10 conversations. And it doesn't mean you're going to book a single meeting.

17:31 Scott Ingram: Man, it is, it is so ironic that you're talking about this. So I just pulled up an email that a listener sent me right about Thanksgiving timeframe. And maybe I'll pose this question to you because I answered it a little bit, but you're in the perfect position to answer it. So she says, I've newly joined a new organization as the first hire in this region. Apart from my sales target, the management also sets daily metric in terms of the number of calls and emails. I've tried convincing them that it's not about the quantity, but it's about the quality. Can I ask how you handle this? So what, what would you, what would you suggest to her?

18:04 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, you know, I think whenever you're new to any role, you know, your responsibility is obviously to, to listen to what the managers are laying out for you and what what management wants to see. That said, I'm a huge proponent of quality over quantity as well. You just need data and results to support that. In sales, results, revenue, that sets you free. So I would just go about that, do what they want you to do, hit those metrics, but then also focus on the quality component and track that and track your results and how they stack up. That way you can go to management with data to support that because those metrics are created by management, people that have analyzed the metrics and they've looked at a lot of the analytics around what works in that role. So they're telling you to do something based off of data, right? Their process is based off of data. So you need to respond in kind. You need to come back with data-driven suggestions. And if you're going to make a case, It's gotta be data and results driven.

19:05 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Yeah. That, and that was basically my, my advice as well, right? Like you, you don't get pressure on silly things like that when you're achieving the end result. So make sure you're achieving the end result. And, and then, you know, hopefully what you're able to do is sort of quantify it and bring data to bear and say, okay, look, here's the silly approach and these are the metrics and these don't, these don't equate to the results that you're looking for. Here's the approach that I'm taking and here's what I wanna be measured on. Right. Let's, Let's measure the number of conversations. Let's look at the conversion from conversation to opportunity and the things that actually matter. Because what we want is not that I called or talked to a lot of people. What you want is a lot of good qualified opportunities in pipeline. So why does anything else matter other than to make sure that, yes, of course I need to be working, but as long as we can assume that that's the case, or I can show some work that demonstrates, yes, I'm continuing to put in these efforts. But let's focus much more on, on the results.

20:08 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, no, definitely. I mean, it's the reason that you have those metrics is those are data-driven metrics, right? I mean, they know what works at a cookie-cutter scale. And, you know, until you have data to drive another conversation, I don't think that you, you know, you're not in the position to be presenting it.

20:23 Scott Ingram: Yeah, well, and that exactly, that's exactly it, right? You can't not do what your leadership is asking you to do if you don't have something else to stand on, right? So first, Start with doing that. And if there are problems with that, and I always suggest, you know, go to an A/B testing level. And Florin Tatulea is the master of this. So, long ago, SDR interview that I did, he contributed some really, really great stories to the First Sale Success Stories book and specifically talked about his A/B testing methodology. And so, typically what I suggest to people is it's what you're doing, Chris. It's you have to put yourself in a position where you're going to have to massively overachieve on the activity metrics. So you're basically, your A set of data is, this is what you're asking me to do. So if what you're asking is for 80 dials a day, okay, here are the 80 dials a day that I'm doing, and here's what the results of that effort looks like. And then you've got to go above and beyond and with a completely separate set of data, track essentially your, what your hypothesis, this is what I think is going to perform better. And being able to then show and have enough data on both sides to say, okay, here's what happens when I do what you're asking me to do. Here's what's happening when I'm doing what I'm wanting to do. And if you put those 2 things together, I can't imagine that you're not overachieving your number. And so again, that gives you the credibility to be able to say, so I want to be able to focus more on, on what's winning that particular A/B test. And again, as long as you continue to overachieve the number, a lot of that pressure tends to, tends to go away. And that's the best way to convince somebody that, that your way is right. It can't be based on theory. It's got to be based on fact and data and results.

22:15 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, 100%. That was worded very well.

22:18 Scott Ingram: Well, tell us a story. What's, what's your favorite, maybe the favorite opportunity that you created because it was, because it was interesting?

22:25 Chris McKenzie: You know, I won't get too specific about, I guess I won't go into the specific agency, but I've created some opportunities within the United Nations that, you know, it's one of my accounts I've been working for a year and, you know, since I started at Zoom really. And that's one of those slow-moving ship type of accounts. You know, there are a ton of moving parts, different organizations within the UN umbrella that have autonomy, you know, purchasing autonomy, but, you know, having I guess working with the UN, number one, I mean, it feels good. You're helping out on a global scale. And I remember having a conversation with a guy that, you know, Zoom is obviously, you know, video conferencing and collaboration platform. This guy was in, I want to say he was in the Democratic Republic of the Congo and he was surrounded by like militants, I believe. And Zoom was the only thing that got him a connection out. And he was able to Zoom his colleagues back in Switzerland and, you know, have like a full conversation in the middle of this like absolute crisis in the middle of the Congo. You know, it was a really great story and this guy ended up being a champion for us internally and absolutely loves the product. And, you know, just knowing that you're helping out on that level because it's really easy, you know, to just get stuck in and used to the use case, right? I mean, there's a standard use case for any solution, but when you see people really, really using it and And doing it, doing something different, especially in an environment like that with the results that he had. It's, it's really interesting and it's kind of, kind of sobering to understand the greater impact that your software is having.

23:57 Scott Ingram: That is really, really cool. That, you know, that goes, that goes beyond, you know, we're just having great sales meetings via Zoom and you get to see everybody. That's, that's something totally different.

24:07 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, very different. Like, you know, lives, lives on the line type of thing, you know, and right in the same vein, I mean, During the Ebola crises that typically happen in the summertime in various parts of Central and South Central Africa, I've had similar stories where these nurses and doctors and people, Doctors Without Borders, they're on the ground and they have no way to effectively train these people that are coming in to volunteer to administer vaccinations and help treat people. And Zoom was the only thing that was able to do that at scale for them. So, you know, now it's just like, okay, I'm in the business of helping people save lives, you know, rather than just, you know, helping businesses run more efficiently and optimize results. It's, it goes a little beyond that. And it's, that's a really cool feeling.

24:56 Scott Ingram: That's really, really cool. I'll tell you my favorite, my favorite Zoom story. Every once a month, and we just got this back on, I skipped about a month and a half after the last Sales Success Summit, but for it, because we sell tickets nearly a year in advance of the event, I feel like You know, I have to be able to provide some tangible value and not just sit on people's money for 10 months or, or a year before they get to actually come to the event. So we've started doing these attendee networking calls. And what we're doing now is essentially overlapping them. So everybody that came to the 2019 summit is invited to continue to participate in the calls along with everybody that's registered for the 2020 summit. Obviously there's, there's a lot of overlap there. But, you know, everybody gets to hear from each other and we just, you know, we set it up and really encourage everybody to use their video and we build friendships, you know, long, long in advance of that event. So, when you walk in the door, everybody feels like they know each other and you get to see like, gosh, Camille is always at LaGuardia on Friday afternoon. And, you know, just all the other kind of fun things that happen there have been some incredible stories and some just some really neat challenges, like real-time issues that we've been able to work through together as a group in some of those calls. So Zoom is an awesome platform for that. Just, you know, being able to put everybody's video up on the same screen, what I call Brady Bunch mode, and being able to look at each other and build relationships in that way when we're all over the world and we only get to come together that one time a year is certainly my favorite use case.

26:34 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, no, I absolutely love that. And I think, you know, because I'm in sales, it always blows my mind whenever I talk to especially larger organizations that, you know, not only aren't using Zoom, but they're not using video in general, you know, to foster those better connections. And I mean, if you think about it from a sales perspective, you know, building relationships better is very important whenever you're on a cold call. At my previous company, we would typically just do audio and screen share. So there was no, you know, there was no real like personal connection there. You're not getting all of the visual feedback. And the nonverbals. And, you know, it really honestly incorporating video into your workflow like that is, is a great way to just accelerate sales processes, you know, get the close and establish rapport super early on.

27:19 Scott Ingram: Yeah, totally. All right. We should shut down the Zoom commercial, but I love the solution. Hey, so you've, you've had a good series, like a really good progression, a lot of success. What are, what are you most proud of?

27:32 Chris McKenzie: Hmm. You know, I think I'm most proud of that revenue number for Zoom. I mean, I think coming into any organization where you believe in the vision and the goal just makes me feel good to know that I'm contributing to the bottom line, you know, that you're not just some… I feel like especially with larger organizations, it's easy to feel like you kind of get lost, you know, within the machine. You're just another cog there. But, you know, with sales, I feel like you tend to break out of that, especially if you're performing. You know, you can see the the actual results on the business itself, on the vision, helping bring that to fruition and continue to grow it. And working previously for a much smaller startup, that impact is a lot more felt, a lot more tangible. You become a big piece of a smaller machine. So I really like seeing the impact on the business.

28:19 Scott Ingram: Nice. What about the flip side? What have you found to be the biggest challenge, or maybe put us at a time where you felt like you were struggling the most?

28:27 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, you know, I feel like everybody in sales has those quarters, you know, where it's slow to start and, you know, you struggle to get traction. And that's happened a couple times for me where it's just, you know, it gets to a point whenever you have a dry spell, you know, where you're not booking any meetings, you haven't got any, you know, brought any revenue in, whatever it is, for a little while you're carrying that energy with you, you know, into every call. And it's hard to, it's hard to break the cycle once, you know, it's kind of self-perpetuating because then you're kind of down and, You're not optimistic, you're not expecting good results, and then that kind of begets poor results. So I feel like it's happened several times where you just kind of get into a rut. One thing that I've done since I've been at Zoom that I tried to establish pretty early on is to absolutely crush the first month of the quarter. If you come into the quarter with some pipeline generated and you're able to crush your meetings, and hit 50% of your quota by the end of the first month, which is typically what I try to shoot for, the rest of your quarter is relatively, you know, it's a lot more relaxed. You can focus on more like high-level strategy. You're not worried about just blindly getting quota relief and you carry that momentum from all those early wins. You're confident, you're excited, you're getting paid well. So that's one way I try to combat that is really just hit it early. And treat the first month like it's the last 2 weeks of the quarter.

29:51 Scott Ingram: That's really smart, you know, because you're exactly right. I think that's a really solid callout around… it's just that psychology and the mentality. And I think of it… and you have to use this in kind of the positive spin because I think it can have a negative connotation… but it's this idea of swagger is the word that always comes to mind for me. Like when you've got that level of confidence It comes through, right? And it's really hard when, when you're behind the number to just get that frame and that mindset and not like, you smell a little bit desperate, right? Like whatever you can do to get out of that. And I think your approach to that and just, you know, really, really, really hammering the first month to establish that, that positive momentum just kind of continues to carry through and you just don't have to work so hard at maintaining it, right?

30:41 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, exactly. There's one, there's a couple terms that I forget where I picked them up around that is an abundance mentality versus a scarcity mentality. You know, if you're hungry and you're starving going into a sales call, you know, they can feel that on the other end. But whenever it's one of your, you know, 10 potential meetings for that day, each one loses its psychological significance and you're able to just kind of carry, you know, just be confident, be composed and, and really just get in the zone. Like you mentioned, you know, that swagger, you're just in the zone. Everyone has those days or those, you know, those times, maybe even, you know, a month long where you just, you can't miss, you know, you know, if they pick up the phone, you're booking a meeting. And that's where we all want to be, obviously, all the time. So that's kind of the, that's the struggle in sales is just maintaining that zone.

31:27 Scott Ingram: Yeah, absolutely. Well, from, from there, I mean, let's talk about the, the motivation side of things. Like, how do you think about motivation? What motivates you? Like, how do you, how do you develop and maintain your drive?

31:41 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. So I think my motivation evolves throughout my tenure at an organization. So when you first come into an organization, you know, my motivation is to, you know, is to make a positive impact, positive impression, you know, get my name out there, hit quota. First of all, you know, you want to make sure that you can do the thing and, you know, really just kind of cement your position within the organization. And then after that, I mean, I like to be the number one at generating revenue or booking meetings, whatever it is. If I'm looking at that leaderboard and somebody's above me, that just bothers me on a fundamental level. So my competitive drive kicks in and I really don't wanna not be at least at the top of the leaderboard. And then beyond that, I think it's, everybody has their their internal or intrinsic motivations in life. I like to… I live downtown and I want to have a certain lifestyle and maintain a certain lifestyle. That requires not just hitting quota, but exceeding quota. Typically, when I come into an organization, I like to tell them on the interview too, I mean, the quota that they give me is… that's the minimum to pay for my seat, but that doesn't necessarily align with my personal goals. I'm going to have personal financial goals and then I'm going to quote a plan and reverse engineer the activity and the metrics that I need to hit to hit my personal goals. The quota typically has no bearing on what I actually want to be doing and how much money I want to make.

33:13 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So we're releasing this, I don't know, probably a week before the end of the year. Walk us through that process, right? Sort of that goal-setting process. When are you doing that? How often are you doing that? Get into the details of of the structure there? Because I'm sure lots of people are in that mode right now.

33:32 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. So I mean, pretty standard quota planning. I'll, I'll pull a bunch of my data. And the more data you have, the more active, more accurate of a predictor this is going to be. But I'll go back and I'll look at, okay, so first of all, how much, how much money do I want to make? And I'll set it there. I'll set the goal for this quarter, I want to make X amount of money. Okay, so how many opportunities does that require? Okay, so historically, how many meetings do I need to book to convert to that many opportunities? And then another layer is historically, how many calls or emails, what's the activity to book that amount of meetings? So it really just, you know, start with your financial goal, you know, I think if that's what's most important to you, and then find out what you need to do in terms of your quota relief to hit that, and then go back into the metrics and analyze, did it the data to figure out what activity goes into that. And the more quarters worth of data or months of data that you have, the more accurate this is going to be.

34:32 Scott Ingram: Beautiful. So let's talk about just a day in the life, or maybe even a week in the life, but let's, let's start with the day, right? So your alarm goes off. What time did that happen? And I want literally the blow-by-blow from there until your head hits the pillow.

34:47 Chris McKenzie: All right. Yes. The blow-by-blow. Alarm goes off, you know, it depends. I mean, that's going to depend, I guess, on the position within the quarter. It could go off at 4:30 AM, it could go off at 7:00 AM. You know, get up, get my… take my puppy out, go for a walk, feed him, hit the shower, get everything ready and head to work. I have about a 35-minute commute, so I'll typically listen to a podcast, you know, like a sales-related podcast, something to get me pumped up for the day. Try to get in the zone early on. I'm gonna do a little bit of reflection or meditation or something on the drive and then get to work. Typically I'll have set up my day the day before that. So I already know what's on the list for the day, what my hit list is, who I'm gonna be reaching out to. And I start doing a little bit of maybe account research or or setting the stage for the activity blocks. And typically around 9, between like 9 and 11, I like to have that as a golden hours, like a block to just be no distractions, hit the phones or the emails, whatever it is. The stuff that, especially the harder things that you have for the day, I like to get that out of the way, get that out of the way early. Like that expression, if you eat a frog in the morning, then You're never going to have to do anything worse the rest of the day. Same thing. I like to get the stuff that I'll tend to procrastinate or maybe that's going to be a little bit harder out of the way. I'm more productive in the mornings, so I'll try to crush all of that in the morning. Typically, I'll hit my activity metrics, what's prescribed to me, before lunch. But that then frees me up the rest of the day to work on all of my more strategic processes And, you know, things that aren't necessarily as quantifiable. And, you know, I work on all of those things in the afternoon and it's a lot, that's a lot more fun for me. It's a lot more cerebral. Then I'll get out of work and I'll, you know, I'll get home probably around 5:00 PM. And from there, I, you know, I have a startup that I work on that's, you know, helping BDRs get trained and placed. And I'll work on that until like 11:00 PM, midnight, and then I'll hit the bed pretty hard.

37:00 Scott Ingram: Nice. So go through the detail of the afternoon process where you're setting up the next day in terms of who you're going after and all that. Like what, what is that? What is that process exactly?

37:11 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. So that, you know, that ties back into what we were talking about earlier with the, with the data and the process, you know, looking at first-party intent data, third-party intent data, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to scan through like all of my, you know, all the resources at my disposal. For data that I can aggregate into, I guess, into a spreadsheet typically and make some sense out of it. So I'm gonna wanna figure out who within my account portfolio has downloaded relevant content, maybe on a partnership network, or who's been visiting our pricing page on Zoom's pricing page, and who is visiting the website more often, whatever I'm gonna be using, but I have a ton of different datasets that I'm going to analyze. And from there, I mean, I'll typically just have a notebook, pen and paper, and write down the names of the accounts that are standing out to me, right? Where I'm like, okay, this account's hot. I view myself as a problem finder. As a BDR, your job is to go out there and find… you might potentially have thousands of doors to go knock on. I don't want to just go knock on those doors randomly. I want to find out who has the problem? Who's gonna answer the door? And, you know, whenever I do that, I'll find it from the account level based on that information. Okay, these guys seem like they have a problem, or, you know, there's, there's some sort of trigger event that leads me to believe that they might need Zoom or that they're gonna be open to a conversation. And I'll write those account names down, and then after I have my list, maybe 4 or 5 accounts, you know, I'll then go into figure out, you know, to get specific with you, I'll go and I'll look at LinkedIn Navigator and I'll find out, okay, which departments are these people that are popping up within my resources, which departments are they in? And I'll look for commonalities. So if, you know, if I see a bunch of people signing up for Zoom from, you know, from their Tempe, Arizona office, or maybe a bunch of people from the HR department, whatever it is, you know, I'm getting a much more specific idea of of where this problem might exist within the organization that is leading them to Zoom or to be downloading this content, and I'll create messaging around that. So the afternoon is really just about honing in on where is the high potential within my account portfolio and then crafting some messaging that's going to be targeted and specific to the different departments, locations, titles, lines of business, business units, whatever it is, and really speak to their use case and the way that we're currently helping people out in that position, adding in some social proof.

39:55 Scott Ingram: Nice. Now, here's what's really interesting to me about the way you described your day. And correct me if I'm wrong, but the heart of it is just 2 super focused hours of actual outreach. And the rest of the work is really just kind of supporting that. Is that a fair understanding?

40:13 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I'd say that's pretty accurate. If you think about like 2 solid hours of activity that's been prepped and set up, it goes a long way. It's one thing to be making cold calls all day and you have to… we don't necessarily have a CRM that's just like, okay, call this account, now call this number, now call this number. If you have that, it's a little bit different. But I think it's It really messes with my flow and getting into the zone like we talked about to dial somebody and then go figure out who I need to dial next and then go figure out who I need to dial next. So you really wanna stay in the zone, prepare everything you need, like have that list of people you're calling, know why you're calling them specifically, like have your talk tracked down in your head or written out. And whenever you prepare for that, I mean, that might take hours to prepare for it, but those 2 hours are gonna you know, they're going to be worth a lot more than even 8 hours of constantly breaking your focus and getting out of the zone to find out who you should call next.

41:15 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So, so let's talk a little bit more about that, the zone, right? So how, how are you sort of defining that? How are you maintaining your focus there and making sure that other stuff isn't, isn't distracting you and pulling you away? Like, how do you just nail that, those 2 hours?

41:30 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. So first of all, you know, I'll put my phone away. It's full of distractions. So I like to get that out of sight, out of mind. You know, sometimes I will, I'll reserve a huddle room, you know, just a little small conference room to do my dials, you know, in, you know, with 4 walls rather than being at my cubicle to reduce any, any environmental distractions. And yeah, and then getting in the zone, I mean, part of it is about having some early wins and early connects within, say, that 2-hour block. So I like to load the beginning of the block with people that I think are gonna answer, right? 'Cause I wanna get my voice out there. I wanna start like hearing my own voice talking, having conversations, you know, working with people as early as possible to help get in the zone. Because when you book a meeting, you know, you're, you're gonna book another meeting if you keep after it. And, you know, that's the point. So I, I like to, to front load that with the highest potential and then some of the harder stuff. If I know there's a guy that's going to be pretty tough to talk to or somebody that shut me down before, I'm going to leave them for a little bit later in that block for whenever I'm already warmed up, whenever that confidence is coming through and I'm not necessarily worried about if the guy or girl is gonna say yes or no. I'm just worried about getting out there, having a conversation. I don't necessarily want to push Zoom on people. In the first place, I want to make sure that, you know, determine if they have a need and if there's a problem. So, you know, whenever I can get in the rhythm of, you know, being in tune with that messaging and, you know, I mean, honestly, it's really easy to dial the phone when that happens.

43:04 Scott Ingram: Nice, nice, nice. I like that a lot. So you talked about podcasts in the morning. Let's get into the details of your information diet. So what podcasts are you listening to specifically? And are there other things that make up your information diet over the course of the day?

43:19 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. So, you know, obviously I listen to your podcast and I listen to the Enterprise Sales Podcast. Those are kind of my, my main 2 in terms of podcasts. And I listen to some other things that are, you know, more related to startups and less related to sales. You know, on the, I guess from a book perspective, a couple of the books that I've, that I've read or am currently reading are Fanatical Prospecting by Jeb Blount, which is, you know, an absolute winner for BDRs, anybody in an outreach position, definitely good for setting your mentality. The Challenger Sale, SPIN Selling, number one bestseller by Lee Bartlett, who I think you had on your show, correct?

43:58 Scott Ingram: Yes. Yes. In roundabout ways, but Lee's awesome.

44:01 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. Lee was great. I actually came across him through another podcast, I think, and got his book. And that book is actually what I used to prepare me for my round of interviewing and applying before I got the job at Zoom, just like his mentality for everything. So that was, that's a great book. Let's Get Real or Let's Not Talk by Mahan Khalsa. Really love that. Sales Development Playbook by Trish Bertuzzi and Selling to Big Companies by Jill Konrath, which is really relevant if you're in the enterprise segment. And The Go-Giver, which is, you know, I forget who wrote that, but it's a terrific… there you go. Yeah. Terrific, terrific book. Yeah, I really like that.

44:39 Scott Ingram: Awesome. Awesome. So you just made me realize that behind my chair right now is a very large box of Lee Bartlett's book, the number one bestseller. And they shouldn't be sitting in a box behind my chair. They should be out in circulation doing some, some good. So let's do this. I don't even know what the ask is. Do something cool or interesting and tell me about it. And I will… and just send me your address and I will send you a book. So I'll give you some ideas. That could be post a review of the podcast on Apple Podcasts, if that happens to be where you listen to your podcasts. Or write a, write an interesting post on LinkedIn about some value that you've gotten out of, out of this show, or I don't care, like do something and then send me an email, scott@top1.fm. Tell me what you did, send me a link and send me your address and I will send you Lee Bartlett's book because they shouldn't be in this box behind my desk. They've been there a long time. So with that, you've hinted at some pieces of kind of your own technology stack, Sales Navigator and SalesLoft and some other pieces. What, what are the rest? I mean, what, what are the core 4 tools and apps that you just can't live without?

45:51 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, sure. So I guess ZoomInfo and DiscoverOrg, big ones, right? I mean, that's, that's how I'm gonna do some list building. That's how I'm gonna find, you know, if I have some email addresses for people within a certain department, I want to talk to everybody else in that department that, you know, has any sort of decision-making authority. So, you know, that's, that's a must. Our internal database, I mean, we have, we have access access to certain internal metrics and datasets that are really helpful for people visiting the website and things like that. TechTarget. I'm not sure, are you familiar with TechTarget?

46:24 Scott Ingram: I can't say that I am.

46:25 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. TechTarget is a really, really cool platform. It's a third-party intent data platform. So they have a network of different resources and I think they're linked to a ton of different tech and software articles, blogs, websites, whatever it is. And they have data on when people are downloading content relevant to what you're selling. So for instance, if somebody's out there and looking at collaboration software, I'm going to be able to see that and I'm going to get sort of a notification or see that within that account's profile within TechTarget that they're interested. They haven't looked at Zoom, but they're interested in what we have. So that's a really good good resource for creating a heat map. And they also have a priority engine where I believe they have a team of people that will cold call. And whenever you have a, I guess it's like a project is what they call it, they will cold call, like TechTarget's team will cold call onto these companies and talk to people in positions of authority to ask if they have any projects around, you know, say video collaboration, and whenever they do, you get a notification that this specific contact has said that they have a specific interest or initiative that's relevant to what you're doing. So that's a really great resource to leverage in terms of finding where some of your account traction is, where you maybe should shift some focus. SalesLoft. So we use SalesLoft for cadences, email automation, managing who you should be calling. And then, you know, I use, I mean, it's not part of our tech stack and of course Zoom, real quick, I have to say that. That's obviously what we use for all of our internal chat and collaboration and building relationships through the power of Zoom. Yeah. And another focus, you know, which isn't technically part of our tech stack is the company website. You know, if I have an account checking out their website and if they're public, looking at their 10-K report, seeing what initiatives they have, messages to investors, you know, what's important to the C-suite. For FY20, FY21. And, you know, another big piece that I always like to incorporate in my messaging is, you know, scanning their site or any resources they have for cultural buzzwords. You know, it's like if you were to reach out to Zoom, one of our, you know, our main thing is delivering happiness. So if you were to incorporate that in your messaging, you not only frame yourself as an insider, but you're, you know, you're more easy to get the attention of a manager or director, show that you've done your research. And you're using the language that people at that company are hearing all the time. I mean, it's like it's going to be in their quarterly presentations. It's something that they're seeing everywhere within the company. So you're… I feel like it's getting within that social DNA of the company and framing yourself as somebody who's tuned in, who cares about what they care about, and you're really framed as an insider there. And along that line is looking at their values and initiatives. A lot of the time you'll see that in the About Me section. You know, just see what's important to them. What… why does that company exist? You know, why did they start that company? And try to frame your solution around that.

49:34 Scott Ingram: Nice. So you've, you've dropped a couple of just like little nuggets throughout this. I wonder if there are other just little tactical things that you're doing that, that you find resonate or help you break through. I mean, I love the, you know, find their own buzzwords and using that. Are there other things that you like that that you find that you're doing on a regular basis that just work?

49:58 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, you know, from, I guess, from a tactical perspective, I'd have to think a little bit on that. But, you know, one thing I do, you know, I guess one thing that a lot of, I think, BDRs especially don't necessarily focus on that isn't specific to messaging, but it's process-related, is leveraging the channel. I feel like the channel relationship with most organizations is typically not not being utilized until you get to the account executive level. And honestly, most BDRs or SDRs are just completely unfamiliar with that world. But I've had a lot of success in reaching out to channel partners that have pre-established relationships and working with my account executives, working out how they would maybe split revenue and figuring out a strategy for breaking into a hard-to-get-into account. Just by leveraging a channel that might already be, you know, selling them millions of dollars worth of software from other providers. And they've got, you know, they're within the corporate structure, they're an approved vendor, and they have an audience within that company.

51:00 Scott Ingram: Nice. Along those lines, is there something you believe that the average rep would think is crazy?

51:08 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I mean, honestly, I think my focus on data analysis in general is kind of kind of out there for most reps. It's definitely not something that is going to come naturally to everybody. And it's just the way that I happen to be focused. So I guess whenever, I mean, typically whenever I'm at Zoom, whenever there's somebody that's struggling to hit their quota, you know, a lot of times they'll come to me and they'll put time on my calendar for, you know, an hour or 2 hours and we'll just sit in a room. And what I always go over is is the data and the process? Because I mean, they sound good on the phones, they're making their dials, and then they're just not hitting quota or they're not getting to where they need to be. And then they'll come to me and try to get some insight into the process and data side because it's, I mean, it's kind of crazy to a degree, just the amount of analysis and aggregation that I do. But whenever I'm able to sit down with you within the context of your accounts and your current initiatives with your account executive, And, you know, put that in context, put that to process that I use, it tends to make a lot of sense and it helps a lot of people out. But yeah, definitely at first that just, that comes off as kind of, kind of weird. It's not the standard for sure for an outreach role. You know, usually you're focused on, on messaging and calling and, and, you know, getting better at the phones. And there's very little focus on, on a process because, you know, it's gonna be laid out for you and you're sort of typically expected to just follow what's laid out.

52:36 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Now, do you think that that is a little bit of a function of calling on the enterprise space, would that approach change if you were in the commercial segment, for example?

52:45 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, really good question because that's something that I've been, that I wondered myself because I've helped people, right, from commercial, from the commercial segment, from our major segment, which is just one up in mid-market and enterprise. And I think the process that I apply is it's less about the process that you're using for your outreach, and it's more about having a process to create a process, right? So it's about coming in with the mentality and the perspective that, you know, you can, regardless of the environment or which segment you're in, you can create a process that is able to leverage more resources than you already are. So I'll sit down and I mean, it's gonna be a little bit different for commercial, like you mentioned. I mean, enterprise, I'm gonna have hundreds of contacts within one organization that are, you know, that I could potentially reach out to. Whereas commercial, you might have 2 or 3. You already know the exact person that's making the calls, you know, making the decisions. But to that end, you have… you make up volume in your account base, so you're gonna have way more accounts. So it's applied differently, but it's really the same whenever you look at it from a process to create a process level.

53:58 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that's fascinating. So what about the flip side to that last question? Is there something that the average or typical BDR believes that you think is crazy?

54:06 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. I mean, I think it really ties into what I just said in the sense that I feel like a lot of BDRs believe you get into the role, you crush the phones, follow the standard, and as long as you put the work in, the hours in, you're going to get results. And I've never been a fan of just trading time. I like to try to create something scalable as early as possible. So yeah, to me, That's kind of wild. Yeah.

54:34 Scott Ingram: Interesting. Interesting. So what have been the most important decisions you've made or lessons you've had to learn to get where you are today?

54:43 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. So, you know, an important decision I made was to, was to drop out and pursue that first BDR role. The next important decision was to pack everything up and move across the country for greener pastures. And that worked out very well as well. And, you know, just, yeah, I guess deciding to really focus on and decide what I want to do with my career in general was a huge piece of that. You know, if you know that you want to become an enterprise account executive, there are certain things that you can be focusing on to work on your brand within an organization or an industry and, you know, prepare as quickly as you can or as thoroughly as you can to get to that next level. To get to that next level and, you know, continue on through your career. So, you know, like you mentioned, you know, being intentional about your career, I think, is a really big, big area of focus for me. And I think it's something that as a BDR, you know, you're kind of expected to, you know, you get into the role and just focus on the cold calls and keep your head down and be successful at that role and then move on. But I think it's good to take a step back and be a little bit more cerebral about the path and, and, you know, to try to define that for yourself so that way everything you're doing sort of ties back to what your goals are.

55:58 Scott Ingram: Nice. So what, what is that next thing for you?

56:01 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, that next thing for me is likely, you know, moving into an account executive role. You know, it's, it's something that I've been, been up for promotion and have been considering for next quarter. But there are also some other, you know, some other factors at play internally that there may be, you know, new roles opening up that I think would be a better fit for myself. So I might be holding out for that.

56:21 Scott Ingram: There you go. Well, and maybe we can tie this next question together with, with what you hinted at before in terms of what you're working on in your after hours. What advice would you give to somebody that's just starting out in their sales career today?

56:34 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I think early on in your sales career, what's really going to benefit you is to hit the phones a lot, you know, pick up and dial. I know for me, I was incredibly nervous about cold calling my first first cold calls, you know, for the first few months probably. You know, it's difficult, but the more conversations you have, the better you get, the less, you know, the less potential they have for turning awkward or not going well. And then whenever you get to the point that you're comfortable on the phones, I would suggest, you know, as soon as you can, maybe after a quarter, a few months into your career, to start looking at the metrics, the data points around your conversion rates and start planning things pretty scientifically. Get scientific about it and plan, quota plan, rather than just being out there and putting activity, because it's very easy to be busy in this role, but it's not so easy to be productive. So I think looking at what makes you productive, where your results are coming from, and then constantly iterating and and improving is, is the name of the game. And then, and then of course, reading, you know, digesting information that, that's created by people that are further along in their career. You know, you don't, you don't have to create this path on your own. You know, you can stand on the shoulder of giants in that sense that, you know, it's been done. People lay out how to get to wherever it is you want to get. So, you know, understanding how people have done that and getting various approaches is really important early on, I think.

58:04 Scott Ingram: Awesome. Now, aren't you working on some, some things along those lines with, with your startup here to help folks with that?

58:10 Chris McKenzie: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. My startup is called Equalify, and the whole focus of Equalify is to put people through an online course to garner the… to learn all of the basics and introductory skills that you're going to need to be a BDR. So it's going to really familiarize yourself with the process and the mentality and get familiar with the tools and performing account research. And getting in, you know, just into the prospecting frame of mind is really important, but it's gonna help people get into, you know, break into these software companies because I know I experienced personally, it can be incredibly difficult to land a BDR or SDR role if you don't have, you know, a clear path to that. If you don't know somebody that's already working there and you've never been in sales, that can be incredibly difficult and it's, at the very least daunting. But going through a program like ours that's going to familiarize yourself with all of the basics and the language to use during your interviews, application strategy and interview process, it gets a lot easier to get in front of the right people and start going on interviews, start working toward getting that job. And I found that, I mean, there are very few colleges out there that even offer a sales program. So sales is, I think, I feel like one of the unsung heroes, you know, of the professional world. And a lot of people just end up in sales, you know, accidentally. But, you know, I think ending up in sales intentionally can be kind of difficult because you just don't know which path to follow. And that's something that we help people do and, you know, break into that software space where, you know, you can work your way up to an enterprise account executive and be pulling down, you know, multiples of 6 figures.

59:56 Scott Ingram: Awesome. Very, very cool stuff. Well, let's continue the advice-giving piece because it sounds like you're doing a little bit of this work. So I'll give… let's say that there is somebody that they've, they've been in a BDR, SDR role, and they just, they had a rough 2019, right? And so now we're heading into 2020. What would you suggest that they do to really kind of turn their game around and take it to the next level?

1:00:21 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I think the first thing that they should do is seek out the top performers on their team. And find out what they're doing. You know, because it… I feel like it's easy to fall into that trap of doing… having a process and then just thinking, okay, well, the way that I'm going to turn this around is by doing more of this thing that's not working. I think you need to get out there and just start talking to people that are having success and figure out what they're doing that you're not doing. You know, if it comes down to your skills on the phone, you know, you practice that. If it comes down to your process, or the way that you're approaching leads or your email messaging. You just… I think you need to identify where your weaknesses are. And the best way to do that is to get out and find out what other people are doing and what's working for them.

1:01:10 Scott Ingram: Love it. So, Chris, what would you want to know about the top BDRs and SDRs in other organizations?

1:01:17 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, you know, I always love hearing about other processes. You know, as I've made it pretty clear, abundantly clear, I'm really process-driven and data-driven, and I would love to hear how other BDRs or SDRs are leveraging data or creating a process that is scaling their ability to target. And, you know, your messaging has to be targeted and specific, which makes it difficult to scale. But I would be very interested in hearing how other people are able to achieve that.

1:01:48 Scott Ingram: Gotcha. Now, have you heard the Florin Tatulea episode? Well, there's your starting point.

1:01:52 Chris McKenzie: I have not. That's a good point. That's the Demandbase BDR, right?

1:01:57 Scott Ingram: No, Florin is at Loopio. Yeah. So it's, it's a, it's a ways back, but we will have links to that along with everything else, all the, all the books, all the technologies, everything else that's been mentioned. You'll find it top1.fm/chris-mckenzie or top1.fm/whatever this episode number is, but I can never keep them straight because there's just too dang many of them. So, Chris, let's, let's get this wrapped up. And what I always try and do is, I mean, we've covered a lot of ground, we've talked about a lot of great stuff, but it's at the end of the day, listening to this and hearing this is, is one thing, but acting on it is another thing. What would you challenge the listener to do to improve themselves and their results over the next, say, just 1 to 2 weeks?

1:02:44 Chris McKenzie: Yeah, I would say 2 things, kind of reiterating what we've mentioned. One thing I would But go back and look at all of the data around your success and your conversions and really have a fundamental understanding of what activity yields what results. So how much activity to get to quota and quota plan for this next quarter, this next year based off of data. Don't let it be a subjective guessing game about what you should do to turn things around because if you've been in your role for a little while, are that you have data to drive your approach. The second thing, like we just mentioned, is go talk to people that are successful. Listen to more podcasts from BDRs, SDRs, or whatever your role is, and just get as much diversity in your approach or at least in the information that you're digesting so you can create an approach that's going to maybe turn things around for you or help you optimize your process.

1:03:43 Scott Ingram: Very cool. If you're not finding enough sales development content here and that's really your interest, check out David Dulany. He's got a great podcast called the Sales Development Podcast. So, that's another great place to start. And if you need other podcast recommendations because somehow you're not finding enough content here, let me know. We've got a giant list and happy to direct you a little bit more specifically around some of those things. So, Chris, this has been fantastic. Thank you for sharing your time with me. Thank you for sharing all of your insight. With all of us, and I look forward to talking with you more.

1:04:16 Chris McKenzie: Yes, Scott, thank you very much for having me.

1:04:19 Scott Ingram: Thanks for listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast. To be sure you never miss an episode and for an invitation to our Sales Success Community powered by Influitive, subscribe to our newsletter at top1.fm.