21: Social Selling his way to the top of the NBA Development League - Allen Schlesinger of the Austin Spurs

0:08 Scott Ingram: You're listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast, where we deconstruct world-class sales performers to provide insights and strategies to help you improve. To learn more, visit us at top1.fm. Here's your host, Scott Ingram.

0:26 Scott Ingram: Today on the Sales Success Stories podcast, my guest is Allen Schlesinger, who is the premium sales manager for for the Austin Spurs. And now Allen has been the number one seller in all of the NBA Development League, now the NBA G League, for the last 4 years running. Welcome to the show, Allen.

0:43 Allen Schlesinger: Thank you for having me. I'm looking forward to this.

0:45 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So I'm excited to talk with Allen as I continue to work to bring really more diversity onto the show in terms of different roles and industries. And Allen is the first in the sports arena. And if you have a suggestion for a unique sales role or industry, feel free to send me a note to scott@top1.fm. I'd love to hear from you. So Allen, we'll start like we always do with the 3 things that you believe have allowed you to get to the top of this particular NBA leaderboard.

1:14 Allen Schlesinger: So there's a few things that, you know, have really helped me set myself apart. One is persistence. You know, I probably don't know what the word no means. I'll follow up on numerous occasions. I utilize texting quite a bit to touch base with people. Then, you know, the other thing is working harder than everybody else. So I'm in the office every morning at 7:30 with my coffee, starting my day that way just to, you know, get ahead of everybody else and have that hour to myself where I'm just focused. And then the last thing is really building relationships. I really try to build friendships with all my clients where, you know, I'm not just hanging out with them at our games, I'm also hanging out with them, you know, socially, whether it's my wife and I or, you know, them and their wife, stuff like that.

2:08 Scott Ingram: Very cool. Now you're also pretty well known as a strong social selling advocate and practitioner. How does that fit in?

2:17 Allen Schlesinger: So they, they refer to me as the LinkedIn guy in our office. Um, I, I don't make any cold calls at all. I haven't made a cold call in over 5 years and You know, in our industry, that's been kind of a no-no. I mean, you… it's, it's still somewhat smile and dial, but I think it's slowly changing. But social selling has allowed me to get in doors that I would have never got to before. I've, I've sold tickets to 2 of the 6 billionaires in Austin, and, and those people would not have taken my phone calls, or their executive assistants would have blocked me from getting into those doors. So it just, it opens up an entirely different world that you'll never get into by a phone call.

3:01 Scott Ingram: Yeah, interesting. And we'll be talking about that a lot more, but why don't you give us just a little bit more context? 'Cause I'm sure a lot of folks aren't familiar with like, how does the sports industry work from a sales perspective? So just talk a little bit about your role and the Austin Spurs and how you got to number 1.

3:20 Allen Schlesinger: So we are, you know, as you mentioned earlier, we're the minor league team for the San Antonio Spurs and we play in the minor league for the NBA, which is called the NBA Gatorade League or G League. And what we do, or my role personally, I'm the premium sales manager. So I'm really focused on our courtside seats and suites. And so, you know, the price range there is anywhere from $3,000 for a couple seats up to over $10,000 for our larger packages. So we're really focused on C-level executives and, and companies that either have a need to entertain clients or companies that need to do stuff for their employees. Employee morale is a very hot button lately, especially with larger employee employers. So I'm really trying to find, you know, companies that have budget to spend on, on things like sports and entertainment. And so LinkedIn allows me to really narrow down who I'm looking for. And then there's some tools that help you find people's contact information that I'll utilize with LinkedIn, whether it be a tool called Hunter or a tool called ProspectWorks that really help you. You know, they, they basically find people's contact information. They scour Google for you. And so I, I've really kind of embraced it. And the NBA seems like they've used me as their poster child pretty much for social selling, where now I've talked to probably a third of the teams in the actual NBA, as well as all the teams in the Development League. I've gone to Charlotte to present at the American Hockey League meetings. And then I presented 2 times now at the NBA D-League meetings, one in Chicago and one in Indianapolis. So it's been fun teaching about this. And I think it seems like more teams now are investing their financial resources and time into learning more on how to utilize social selling.

5:15 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And we were talking earlier, you are really almost 100%, not cold because you're using social, but talk about kind of your daily goal and how that kind of works.

5:29 Allen Schlesinger: So I set a personal goal for myself if I'm in the office and not out on appointments to hit about 100 new people every single day. Most of those people I'm reaching out to through email by using LinkedIn and those tools that I mentioned. To find those people. And then I try to focus on landing about 10 face-to-face meetings a week in the Austin area. And, and hopefully from, from one leading to the other, there's 2, roughly 2 new deals that close every week as a result of those efforts. It takes a lot of time to hit 100 people a day. And, and so that's why, you know, I'll come in early just to get, you know, to get going faster.

6:07 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Awesome. And quantify your results for us. I mean, what does it take to be number 1 in all of the NBA G League?

6:14 Allen Schlesinger: So I hit a personal best from the '16-'17 season, which just ended in April. I did $500,000 in ticket sales. And just to put that into perspective, the 2nd highest person in our league did about $300,000. So it was great for me, obviously, to continue to push myself. And so now, for next season, or the season we're currently selling for that starts in November, you know, going for $600,000 would be the next logical step. So it, it's going to take a lot of hard work and effort, but I'm hoping I'll get there.

6:48 Scott Ingram: Yeah, nice. And what was your, what was your quota? What were you supposed to do?

6:52 Allen Schlesinger: So somewhere in the $400,000 to $450,000 range. I mean, my, my boss and I have developed a very good trust where he knows, you know, what I'm doing. And, and my boss is based in San Antonio, so he's actually not here in the Austin market. He comes up once a week, but, um, you know, somewhere in that 400 to 450 range.

7:10 Scott Ingram: Nice. And what's your origin story? How did you get into sales in the first place? Because I think you've always been in the sports space.

7:17 Allen Schlesinger: So it was kind of an accident, you know. I, I graduated from the University of Texas at San Antonio in 2007 and, uh, did what no college kid wants to do… move back home with his parents. Which my parents at the time were living in McAllen, Texas. And so I moved back in and, you know, of course, you know, trying to find a job and got a job doing, uh, proofreading for a local kind of version of the Austin Chronicle down in McAllen called RGV Magazine. And I was making $16 a day, so, uh, not a lot of money a day. Yeah, it was almost like a favor to my dad just to get me out of the house to proofread articles because Journalism was my background. That's what I thought I was going to do. But as we know, newspapers are slowly a dying breed right now. So I happened to meet the president of the team down there, which is the Houston Rockets affiliate. Um, and I… he actually interviewed me on the spot. You know, they were like, Allen needs a job, a full-time job. And I thought I was interviewing for a PR position. And so the next day he calls me and offers me the job. And then the next day after that, I start the job. And on the first day, he puts a phone book in front of my face and says, start making calls. No sales experience at all at the time. I mean, I was scared out of my mind. So I, I went home that day, and my dad had run a large insurance company down there. And so he opened his Rolodex to me, and I started getting more comfortable by calling, you know, his contacts first. And they were all buying tickets. And then, you know, ended up becoming their top seller their first season in existence, which was the '07-'08 season. And then in March of, uh, '08, I ended up applying for a job with the Spurs organization, and they offered me a job here in Austin.

9:08 Scott Ingram: Nice. At what point did you get comfortable? And, and I mean, what was that transition to, okay, first of all, I didn't even know I was going to be in sales and you just thunked the phone book in front of me, to now you're number one? And I, I assume at some point along that line, you kind of hit your stride?

9:25 Allen Schlesinger: I think it was probably, you know, after being in Austin for about 3 or 4 years, because when I first came here, I was like, okay, I did really well in McAllen. This city is 15 times the size of McAllen, so it should be relatively easy. But little did I know that, you know, at that time we were the Austin Toros and the brand awareness wasn't where it needed to be back in 2008. So I struggled at the beginning, but, you know, I'm, I'm one of the most competitive people. Um, I, I do not like to lose. So I just started trying to think of ways back then, you know, how can I get in front of these business owners in the Austin area? So I really started… after about a year of trying to, to cold call people, I really started leaning on email at the time because LinkedIn wasn't really in existence at that point, or if it was in its infancy. And email started getting me more appointments, so I was like, well, I'm going to just lean on this. And then, you know, LinkedIn comes into the picture, and, and I became one of the first, I guess, in the sports industry, early adopters of LinkedIn, and just started getting appointments left and right from it. So then, you know, I had all the confidence in the world at that point to continue to do what I'm doing.

10:40 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And is there anything that you wish you would have done differently earlier in your career to kind of build this base that you've got now?

10:50 Allen Schlesinger: Um, you know, I think early on I was probably… my, my meeting strategy was probably not as good as it is now. I mean, that would be the only thing, like the ability. And, and I teach this in some of the consulting jobs I do with other teams, the ability to small talk. And build relationships with, with clients is so important because they're, they're not just buying basketball tickets, they're buying you because they trust you. And so I think early on, you know, my first meeting, I'll never forget this, when I was working for the team at McAllen, we have a, we have a group at the NBA, they're called TMBO. It's Team Marketing and Business Operations. And what they are is they're consultants that work with every NBA, WNBA, and G League team. And so I've had the same TMBO guy with me since 2008. He was with us in McAllen and he's with us here in Austin now. And I'll never forget, you know, we go to meet this company, it was like a logistics company, and we're sitting there, we're pitching the tickets. We get out of the meeting and he says to me… his name's Jerry, the, the guy from TMBO… he says, you know, you were clicking that pen the entire meeting. It was one of those clicking pens. And he goes, I'm never going to allow you to have a a pen clicker in a meeting again. You're gonna have a regular pen. And the company ended up buying a massage chair instead of the season tickets. You could tell I'm still bitter about this one. But, um, so it was more my, my actual meeting strategy, I think, is the only thing that I, I have definitely evolved over time.

12:20 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So I mean, what does that look like today then? Like, how are you structuring that meeting? Because that's obviously one of the key ingredients, right? You've got those 10 meetings a week you're after.

12:28 Allen Schlesinger: Well, like today I was on a meeting and like we were having lunch, uh, me and this guy who owns a company that does physical fitness. And we're talking about, you know, probably during the lunch, the first 30 minutes, just talking about basketball and, and the community. And we didn't even get into product knowledge. I want him to feel like, you know, he can trust me. So we didn't until after we had finished eating. Is when I showed him, okay, this is what the season tickets cost. It's really pushing that on the back burner, learning as much as you can about them. And just through talking, we found out that he knew one of my other season ticket holders. So it's just really trying to learn as much as you can about them.

13:10 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Well, and that, that's a big part of your approach then, right? Is sort of relating to who else do you know that they know, or that are other clients of yours. Talk, talk about that a little bit.

13:19 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah. I mean, Once you can, you know, build up a network, because that's the key, is building up that network locally. And that's, you know, for a new rep, I would say attending chamber events and networking events. And once you do that, you know, when you're going on meetings, you can look at your mutual connections on LinkedIn and name-dropping either the companies or the people is so powerful. I mean, it's amazing how that just adds so much credibility to what you're doing when they're like, Oh, my friend already has season tickets. And then they'll sometimes straight up ask, are there seats open next to him? I'd be interested in purchasing those. So it makes it so much easier to make the sale at that point.

14:00 Scott Ingram: Yeah, absolutely. Now, is there a favorite sales story of yours? Maybe one different than the pen-clicking experience?

14:07 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah, that's probably not a good one to share. So I use a variety of methods to find what I would call you know, buyers that have expendable income. And one story that I like to share is that one thing that I like to use is public records. So you can actually look up like the values of people's homes. And I'm sure that was not meant for sales reps for the Austin Spurs, but it's public information. And so I had sold season tickets to a company here in the area that sells private jets. And they are great at what they do. And, and, um, and then I looked up their neighborhood and I found, you know, all their neighbors' names. So I would cross-check their neighbors with LinkedIn. And one of their neighbors specifically was the CEO of a company. So I reached out to him and I said my normal approach. I have a format email that I send everyone. And then he replied and, and then I, you know, we were going back and forth. He was giving me crap because he was a Mavs fan. And he's like, I don't even like the Spurs. And, and we just, you know, going back and forth joking and stuff. And I was like, by any chance, do you know these people? And I just dropped it in an email. And he was like, yeah, that's actually my neighbor. And he didn't know that I had done some background work on him. And, um, and I was like, well, they just bought 2 season tickets in, in some of our top-level courtside seats for next season. I actually have the 2 seats open to them, you know, for next year as well. And he ended up buying the 2 seats next to these people because they're his neighbors and, you know, they enjoy each other's company. So, you know, he didn't know that I had done all this background work. Not… it wasn't just a cold email.

15:50 Scott Ingram: So, and, and now they're neighbors on and off the court.

15:53 Allen Schlesinger: They are. And they, they have renewed now for their 3rd season coming up with us. So they've stuck, stuck loyal with us and become actually some of our biggest fans and, and champions.

16:03 Scott Ingram: Nice. What's, what's the biggest challenge that you have in sales today?

16:09 Allen Schlesinger: Probably awareness. And, and in Austin, there's also a lot to do. So it's, it's how do you stand out? Um, you know, we play in Cedar Park, and to me personally, downtown Austin to Cedar Park is not that bad. But, you know, some of these companies think that… I've gotten emails where they say Cedar Park is South Dallas. And it's just, you know, I know we have traffic in the city and I get it, but if you have a company that has 200 or 300 employees and you're based downtown, you know, you can find ways for the employees to use the tickets. So it's, it's brand awareness and, and distance, because a lot of our major employers, you know, are in that downtown market. And I don't know, maybe I'm just… I live downtown and I'm used to driving all over the place for meetings and, and going to San Antonio quite a bit for meetings. And so those are probably the 2 biggest issues that we deal with.

17:05 Scott Ingram: Yeah, yeah. And just a geography lesson for those who aren't in Austin, I suppose I should have shared that Allen's sitting down with me here in my home. So it's one of those nice interviews that I get to do in person. So Cedar Park is kind of northwest of town without traffic, and that's a big factor, right? It's probably 30 minutes, right, from downtown Austin. And then San Antonio's about 75 miles, maybe an hour and a half. Uh, south of Austin, straight down I-35. Another geography lesson: I-35 runs all the way from the Mexico border to the Canadian border. So the company that I work for in Minneapolis, if I ever wanted to drive there, I could go straight up I-35 for a very long time.

17:47 Allen Schlesinger: And by the way, I made it from our arena in Cedar Park last night to downtown in 27 minutes. I, I actually mapped it, so It's possible, you know, under 30 minutes.

17:57 Scott Ingram: Nice. Well, and we talked a little bit earlier, you know, I think your results are even more impressive in that you don't have the benefit of a big-name team and a big brand, uh, behind you. And I, I think what your approach shows is that just that persistence, that hard work, hitting those numbers every day, you're able to produce phenomenal results regardless of you know, what the product or how well-known the product is, I guess we should say.

18:27 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah, I mean, we, like I mentioned, the brand awareness thing, it makes it a little more of a challenge for us, but we, you know, we're always out in the community. We're doing events to keep our names out there. But yeah, it's that 100 people a day that really allows me to succeed. 'Cause if I didn't, I mean, my numbers would not look like what they do.

18:48 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Now, now do you compare that to the other folks in the office? I think you said there's, there's 8 other sellers in the, in the Austin Spurs organization, obviously many, many more across the, the G League. Do I compare their, their activity? Right. So are, are they doing 100 touches a day?

19:04 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah. I mean, so I've, I've had talks with our ticket sales manager cuz he manages our 5 sales reps. And so we've talked about, you know, they've, they've ramped up their activity where they're, they're hitting those levels and now their meetings are showing more. I mean, some of our sales reps have different focuses than others. So while I'm focused on corporate and all companies, we have some sales reps that are focused on schools because we have big school day games every year where we have 5,000 kids come out on school field trips. So that takes a lot of their time. But, you know, we're all trying to push each other to get better on a daily basis. We celebrate our wins together. We actually earned a cruise in at the end of August. So our sales staff will be going on a cruise because we all hit our numbers as a team. So we, you know, we're all trying to push each other so we can earn these extra benefits.

19:57 Scott Ingram: Nice, good stuff. So let's, let's tear apart your, like, the specifics of your routine and, and such. So you're getting into the office early. What time are you getting up and, and what does that morning process look like?

20:08 Allen Schlesinger: So 5:30. In the morning, uh, wake up, you know, get, get dressed for work and go. Um, I guess I gotta walk the dog before I, uh, before I head out in the morning. And I, I, I'm a Starbucks addict, so I'm there every morning, and they're getting a free plug right now, I guess. Not that they need it.

20:25 Scott Ingram: They need it. Yeah, not a sponsor of the show.

20:28 Allen Schlesinger: And, uh, and, you know, have my coffee, and, and I'm usually at the desk by 7:30, and I'm just, you know, I, I'm just going wherever I left off from the day before. So I'm searching by job titles. I'm searching by universities. I'm searching LinkedIn by keywords in their profile. So if they've mentioned the word basketball in their profile, obviously an easier in. Um, you know, LinkedIn Sales Navigator allows you to search so many different functions, whether it's changed jobs in the last 90 days, because to me that means they may have a new budget to play with, someone that's new at a company. So many different things. And then I'm also searching like connections of my existing connections. Like, who can Scott introduce me to that's in his network in Austin? And so I'm just, you know, you'll never run out of leads. That's why I tell, you know, sales reps I talk to is that like, you should never come to your boss to ask for leads because when you're in a city that looks like ours or is as big or bigger than Austin, there's so many people here and that are moving here on a daily basis and companies that are expanding, companies that are coming in from California. So it's just targeting everything and everyone. And I get on these tangents, like it's crazy. Like I call myself like a ticket nerd because I'll be searching for VPs of sales from companies and then somehow I'll end up like on this random tangent looking for basketball fans or it's just all over the place. And so I don't have a rhyme or reason to the way I do things, but what I do do is once again, like I mentioned before, is try to get to that 100 people a day.

22:07 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Now, is that just sort of back and forth throughout the day where you're kind of doing that research and you do some outreaches, maybe some more research, or do you kind of chunk that up where you're doing the research, you kind of build your list, and then you do the outreach? And then where do you fit the meetings in? Like, what does the rest of the structure of your day look like?

22:25 Allen Schlesinger: So I'm doing… well, my meetings I try to do in the mornings. So I'll start, you know, the earliest I think we've ever done a meeting is 7:00 AM. And that was because the CEO wanted to meet that early. But I'll start either 7 or 7:30, you know, for meetings and, you know, hopefully wrap them up just after lunch and spend the rest of the day prospecting. But what I'll do is I'll… whatever search I'm doing on LinkedIn, I'll have it and then I'll, I'll go through like the first page of leads basically and just open up separate window tabs and then go one by one and just reach out then. And then go to page 2, open up separate window tabs and the ones that I think make sense to reach out to And then just go one by one by one and just keep going and going and going.

23:10 Scott Ingram: And, and what is that outreach specifically? Are you sending a LinkedIn note? Are you sending an email? Are you… is, is it just one touch? Like, what does all that look like?

23:21 Allen Schlesinger: So I prefer email, and, and mainly because LinkedIn Sales Navigator only allows you to have 30 InMails a month. So I'm doing everything I can by using some email finding tools to, to reach out to these people. I'm introducing myself, I'm introducing the team. I specify in every email that this could be for business or personal use because that doesn't give them an out either way, you know. And I'm asking for 15 minutes for coffee. So I'm buying these people a cup of coffee once I get the meeting. The meetings never last 15 minutes, they're usually like 30 minutes to an hour. It's just very non-threatening to get you know, your foot in the door with some of these companies.

24:00 Scott Ingram: Sure. And, and what's really fascinating about your approach is you told me earlier that you don't even really have a follow-up strategy. This is 100 new people every day. And is it, is it just that single email? Is it just one touch?

24:15 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah. So I actually, like, just for example, this morning I had an email back from an assistant vice president of a company here that I had emailed 3 months ago. And she was like, uh, do you still work for the Spurs? I'm interested in tickets and I'm finally back in Austin. So like, that's why I like to touch 100 new people a day, because you never know when you're going to get an email back from someone from like 3 or 4 months ago instead of recycling the same old leads over and over again. What I'll do is though, if I stumble on someone's profile that I already reached out to a while back, I'll, I'll reach out to them again. Just because I'm like, hey, this person never reached out to me. I'm looking at their profile again and then I'll follow up. But no, I don't. And people think it's crazy. Like people I talk to, they're like, you don't have a database where you keep these people? I'm like, no, I just go, go, go as fast as I can because I want to get as many out as possible.

25:08 Scott Ingram: That's interesting. Now, does that outreach email, is it pretty templated or you're spending a little bit of time kind of personalizing it and making some sort of connection?

25:15 Allen Schlesinger: It's actually, pretty much the same every single time. The only thing I change is hello and I put their name, the person's name. So it's a copy paste, hello and the first name of the person.

25:26 Scott Ingram: Wow.

25:26 Allen Schlesinger: And it's, yeah, I mean, unless like, if someone warmed it up for me, then I'll say, hey, you know, so-and-so told me to reach out to you and then, you know, I'll do it differently.

25:39 Scott Ingram: Got it. So from a percentage standpoint, you're obviously doing the 100 a day. You, but you also said that the relationships and, and kind of the, the clients that you work with, I mean, you do get kind of referrals and things like that from, from them. How much of your revenue comes from that, the cold outreach efforts versus the relationships and the referrals and your existing clients?

26:03 Allen Schlesinger: I'd say probably 70% from the cold, 30% from the clients. And it goes up during the season, like in the off season, you know, clients are busy there. It's summer, you know, they're taking vacations with families and stuff. But once the season gets closer, you know, it ramps up. But, um, it's, it's literally just… and it's so much more important to do it in the summer too because not a lot of people are thinking about basketball during the summer. So the more people you touch, just, it gives you a better chance to succeed because, you know, football starts in September, so people are like, let's get excited for football season right now, and they don't really focus on basketball until football starts winding down sometimes, especially we're in Texas where football is a big deal.

26:48 Scott Ingram: It's the primary sport.

26:49 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah, yeah. So yeah, definitely have to try harder in the summer to get those meetings.

26:55 Scott Ingram: Sure, sure. And then what happens, what time are you wrapping up your day and is there anything, like kind of what happens after that?

27:03 Allen Schlesinger: So usually about 6 o'clock, I'll head home for the day. I'll check emails when I get home, but I'm not like, you know, I try to disconnect when you get home 'cause you need that break. I mean, you've basically been, when you wake up at 5:30 in the morning, you've kind of, you know, run out of energy by the time you get home. So it's just kind of unwind.

27:24 Scott Ingram: Yeah, yeah. At that point you've done your 12 hours and it's time to relax. Nice. And is there, do you structure any days differently? I mean, is it basically the same routine every day? It just sort of depends on how many meetings you have or do you find that, oh, Mondays are a little bit different than, than Wednesday or Friday, for example?

27:44 Allen Schlesinger: I've noticed that like Tuesdays are my best meeting days. So like those days are probably unique. And what I do, um, you know, we have a Spurs vice president that usually comes to market to Austin on Tuesdays. So I will use his title to kind of help me get more meetings because he wants to go on meetings. He wants to get out and meet with Austin companies. And so I can… using his title gets me more meetings. I mean, a vice president from the Spurs. So that day usually has probably the most meetings. And I would say Monday and Friday are usually more on the prospecting front because those days people aren't as willing to meet as much as Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. So it's probably heavy prospecting Monday, Friday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday kind of changes depending on how many meetings I have those days.

28:32 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Yeah. So you're obviously leveraging kind of your, your executive there. I mean, Barry Womack. From Cvent talked about that and how he's leveraging different people from the organization. You know, it's… I often find that the executives, they want to have opportunities to be in front of customers and be involved in those meetings. So it's not like you're putting a burden on them. And if anything, it's, it's an opportunity for you to develop that relationship further and, and help them in, in just staying close to their customers and their base.

29:01 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah, I mean, it definitely like helps where he can speak to the San Antonio-Austin relationship and how important the Austin Spurs are to the San Antonio Spurs. And so while I'm doing the pitching of the product, he just speaks more to the overall big picture for the 2 organizations together.

29:22 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Nice. Now, what does your information diet look like? What are you reading, listening to, and watching?

29:28 Allen Schlesinger: I, I try to read like sales books. I mean, social selling books. Um, it's been a couple of months since I've read one, mainly because process of planning a wedding. And as you know, that's, uh, that's always a, a challenge. And, and so, um, so really just trying to learn about, you know, the different tools that other people are using. Um, and I'm, I'm also reaching out to other teams to see, you know, what's working with them. The Sacramento Kings have been a great case study. They were featured in Forbes on, on their social selling ideas and platforms that they use. So I actually, I've reached out to their vice president of sales just to learn a little more about what they're doing. And so I'm just trying to pick up, you know, I do a lot of these consulting gigs where I train other teams on social selling. And what I do, and I tell them at the beginning, is I try to pick up something from each of them. You know, I don't want to be the only one teaching here. I want to learn something from each of them. So it's really just always learning and always trying to get better because, you know, what you know today might not be the most relevant tool that you'll need tomorrow.

30:38 Scott Ingram: Yeah, love that. Love that. On the book front, are there any that really stand out? I mean, what's, what's your favorite book on social selling, for example?

30:48 Allen Schlesinger: Putting me on the spot here. Um, there The problem is I can't remember the name of it right now, but there was a book, the guy called himself a LinkedIn expert and it was referred to me. It just talked about like, these are the steps that you can take on a daily basis to get better at social selling. And of course I'm blanking on the name right now, but it was just interesting to me, like, 'cause the one thing that I wasn't doing as much as I do now is, is really interacting with people that you're not connected to. And, and I picked that up from that book. I mean, some of the other stuff that was in that book was something that, you know, were things that I was already doing. But the, the interacting with CEOs and, and just commenting on their stuff and letting them know that you're around helps you build that relationship without even being… you don't even have to be connected to them on LinkedIn to comment on their stuff. And so that, that really was a tool that I picked up from it, and I'm sure that it'll come to me later on.

31:52 Scott Ingram: Yeah, we'll put it in the show notes so you can just send me an email afterwards. And again, no idea what episode number this is, but if you go to top1.fm/Allen, A-L-L-E-N, we'll definitely have that, that book link in there so you can check that out. Any other standout books, social selling or otherwise?

32:09 Allen Schlesinger: It's more like publications and articles, honestly. Like, I'll, I'll search just, you know, I'll search social selling experts and just see what comes up. And a lot of people will write tips and articles. I mean, Forbes magazine has a lot of different things, and, and, you know, there's people that I follow on Twitter that, you know, post a lot of stuff just about social selling. And so it's really just picking up small tidbits here and there that, that help you succeed.

32:37 Scott Ingram: Yeah, so just the, the increment… incremental little nuggets, whether they're from your peers or they're from articles or anything else, just every little bit to improve your process.

32:45 Allen Schlesinger: Exactly.

32:45 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Um, what about other tools or apps? I mean, we've already talked about LinkedIn and Hunter and some of those other things. Are there other tools that are kind of core to your process?

32:58 Allen Schlesinger: So there's, there's, uh, one I've started using recently called LeadIQ, and, and then there's another one that works with artificial intelligence, and I can't remember the name of it, but it literally like scours the internet and like pulls like the information not only from their contact info but like all of their social profiles. And so it's incredible. I mean, these, these tools that have… I mean, until recently I was literally scouring the internet myself to try to figure out people's email addresses and, and reach out to them. And now these tools basically speed up the process for what I'm trying to do. So those ones mainly. I mean, I'm, I'm looking at Who's donating to political parties, because I know you can search that by zip code. Um, you know, in the Austin Business Journal every week, that's like my favorite publication to read because it comes in every Tuesday, and in the back of it, it has every house that has sold in Travis and Williamson County, which are the 2 counties in the greater Austin area, and how much those homes sold for and who bought and sold the home. So then I'm cross-checking their names on LinkedIn To see, you know, okay, so-and-so bought a $1.2 million home. Well, you know, they can definitely afford season tickets. How am I going to reach out to them? So just trying to get creative, you know, who's on nonprofit boards? Those people usually have expendable income. Those are some of the bigger tools that I use.

34:24 Scott Ingram: Nice. And we'll link up whatever the AI piece was. We'll put that in there as well on top1.fm. Allen, is there a particular sales philosophy that you subscribe to?

34:38 Allen Schlesinger: Hmm, that's a tough one. Um, you know, it's, it's really just push yourself. I mean, I, I know it's kind of cheesy, but it's, you know, you can control… there's certain factors that you can control and there's certain that you can't, but you can control how hard you work and you can control I can outwork the person that sits next to me. And so putting yourself in the best chance to succeed is probably by doing that. I mean, that's, that's how, you know, I've been successful, and that's how, you know, I've seen others in the industry that I've just tried to learn from. I mean, you know, my, my boss in San Antonio is probably the hardest working person I know. I mean, he's been with the Spurs for 17 years, so about almost double as long as I have. And he actually wakes up at 4:30 every morning, so he's got me beat by an hour because he goes to the gym for an hour every morning. And, um, it amazes me because I can literally text him at 6:30 about a question about a deal I'm working on, and within 5 minutes, I mean, he's responding at 6:30 in the morning. And so like this morning we were talking about one of our season ticket holders, and we… I had some questions about a question that the season ticket holder had asked me, and I sent him a text at like 6:15, hey, can you give me a call regarding this season ticket holder? And he called me at 6:20, and like, I'm like, you, you never sleep. Like, he doesn't sleep. And I'm like, I don't know how you do this. So, you know, that kind of stuff pushes me. I'm not gonna be getting up at 4:30. I mean, it's just, uh, it's drawing the line. Yeah, I gotta draw the line somewhere. Um, but it it, you know, it just shows how if you have someone, you know, that, that is in your management that pushes themselves, it just motivates everybody else to fall in line.

36:29 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And how would you describe your style then in the way that you carry this out?

36:34 Allen Schlesinger: So, I mean, uh, it's, it's funny because like he'll, he'll sit there when the day he comes up, you know, to our office and it's just dead silence in our office, like I'm literally sending emails and he's like just amazed that like you could just hear a pin drop. So it's really, it's really just laser focus. You know, I'm good at multitasking. So if someone, you know, comes in and asks me a question in the office, I can, I can do both at the same time. And that, you know, that's just learning that after, you know, 9 and 9 and a half years working for the Spurs, it's just, you know, learning how to multitask. So just laser focus. I mean, I know what I want to do and what I want to accomplish every single day, and I know how hard it is to do that, so I just keep pushing myself to focus.

37:23 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So what is that push? Like, what, what's motivating you in all of this?

37:28 Allen Schlesinger: I want to stay on top. And, you know, obviously in sales, as you know, is the more you sell, the more money you'll make. And so Um, I just want to keep getting better every year. I don't want a year where even if I'm still number 1, my revenue was a little bit less than the year before. And so I could, you know, rest on my laurels and say, hey, you know, I was, I was number 1 this year, but instead of $500,000, I sold $450,000. Like, to me, that's just… it's unacceptable. And so just, just push. And, and my wife is the same way, and so maybe that's why we're perfect for each other. But we're wired that way where we, we both get in early and we both want to be the best at what we do. And so, um, just to continue, you know, and, and I want to see my name number 1 on the leaderboard. I mean, the, it's… the league releases the leaderboard rankings once a month and like, you know, I'm like, if they're a day late, I send them an email and be like, why haven't you guys released the leaderboard rankings? You know, and they probably hate me for that, but I, you know, I… they just need a little reminder every once in a while, you know.

38:30 Scott Ingram: So Right, right. So yeah, so it sounds like at the end of the day it's not just number one, but it's also besting yourself year over year.

38:37 Allen Schlesinger: Exactly. No, I, like I said, I just want to get better every year. And, you know, whatever that looks like this coming year, like I said, $500,000 last year. I'm hoping, you know, $600,000 is a personal goal for me for, for this year.

38:52 Scott Ingram: Yeah. What, what, what was the goal for you the beginning of, of this year?

38:57 Allen Schlesinger: So we, we haven't set that yet. Um, I'm assuming it's going to be somewhere around $550,000.

39:03 Scott Ingram: No, no, I'm talking about for this, this previous year. I mean, was $500,000 the, the goal for this year?

39:08 Allen Schlesinger: Would you start this season? Yes.

39:09 Scott Ingram: Yeah.

39:09 Allen Schlesinger: And, you know, I knew, and, and I had talked to my boss about it because no one in the league's history… and league's been around for I think around 16, 17 years… had done $500,000 in ticket sales. And so to be the first one, to me, that was just like a personal achievement. Like, I want to be the first one to hit that. And I know how hard it's going to be to hit it. I mean, it took me probably about, you know, roughly a week or 2 before the season to get there. Because I used to… I like to hit my goals before the season, even though we have the entire season to hit them. And so, you know, once I hit that, it was awesome. Like, our ticket sales manager was really cool. He called everyone in the conference room and they got like a cake for me and had a little Mr. $500K thing going. And, and, uh, we, we, we have an amazing culture that we've created, like where we're all in it for each other. And so it's, it's fun to celebrate together. You know, we have a couple of new sales reps that have started recently. And so like their first sale, we made sure we all, you know, just gave them a high five and thanked them and said, This is the first of many. So we… it's really, it's really a great team environment that we've created together.

40:22 Scott Ingram: Love it. That's awesome. Is there something that you believe or that you do that the average sales rep would think is crazy?

40:32 Allen Schlesinger: Well, I think the public records thing, you know, it's funny, is like…

40:35 Scott Ingram: it's the stalking, is that…

40:36 Allen Schlesinger: well, so yeah, that's the word I was, I was getting ready to use. You got it for me. But, uh, I've actually done this presentation that I do consulting for a group of IT salespeople. We had, we had a company that asked me to come speak and they had 140 salespeople. And I started doing this and, and I was like, many of you would call this stalking. My boss calls this geo-targeting. And, and, uh, you could… the words are interchangeable, I guess. But that usually like really initially shocks people. But then I think after like 20 seconds of processing it, they're like, this could actually really help me get better. I mean, you know, I found, you know, people that I never would have found because they don't want to be found. And, and that's funny because on my LinkedIn it says, you know, most of my meetings, they start off with the person telling me, how did you find me? And, and the answer I always say is LinkedIn because it's the least stalkerish, I guess, if you want to say the least creepy. Um, but, um, so That one is the one I think that just like boggles people's minds because the, you know, the, the Hunter and the other stuff with LinkedIn, you know, I'm sure there's a lot of people using those tools, but, you know, thinking outside the box of like, how am I gonna find, you know, people near my arena with a high income that could be season ticket holders?

41:58 Scott Ingram: Sure, sure. Well, and at the end of the day, I mean, we can joke about it being called stalking or geo-targeting, but we're talking about public records. I mean, there's, there's nothing, you know, nefarious about what you're doing.

42:10 Allen Schlesinger: Yeah, I mean, I had literally last season… I'll tell you a story that happened. I was going through, um, political donors. Obviously we had an election last year, and, and, um, and I had found a guy, um, in the Cedar Park area where we play who had donated $5,000 to the Trump campaign. And so I emailed him right after I found his contact, emailed him right after that. The next day I went in for a meeting with him. He invited me to come the next day, which usually it's the next week, but he was like, oh, come by tomorrow. I just moved my company here to Cedar Park. He dropped $5,000 on tickets the next day. And so I would have probably never found him if I wasn't looking for who's donating to what political campaign.

42:51 Scott Ingram: Sure, sure. Now what about the, the flip side? So we talked about something you do that others think is crazy. Is there something that the average seller does that you think is is crazy.

43:00 Allen Schlesinger: This is going to give me a lot of heat, but cold calling. I mean, I, you know, I've spoken to… I actually went to Baylor University. They have one of the best sports management programs in the country, and they asked me to come speak to… they actually have a program for kids that are interested in becoming what I do, ticket sales.

43:19 Scott Ingram: Really?

43:19 Allen Schlesinger: You can graduate with a degree in sports management with a concentration in ticket sales. Which Baylor is one of the few universities that has it, and they're very well known for it. And so they asked me to come speak, and I'm on this panel, and the professor says, when's the last time… there was 5 people on the panel… when's the last time you guys made a cold call? And everybody else was like, yesterday or last week. And I said… I was like last to go… I said, I haven't made a cold call in 5 years. And it was like a pin like dropped in the room, like you could hear it. Like there was dead silence. And, um, I didn't think it was weird, but I think everybody else thought it was weird because they were trained. You know, they had done, I think, a project with the Houston Astros where they had to call Astros single-game buyers to try to upsell them into ticket packages. But they were doing that through the phones. And I'm like, I, like, I, I probably… it's been so long since I made a cold call that you may have to train me on how to do that again. Because honestly, like, and like What's funny is sometimes our other reps will make fun of me. They'll be like, do you even know how to use your phone? Like, it's… I know it's there, it's collecting dust and stuff, but do you even know how to use it? So yeah, that's probably cold calling, honestly. Yeah, that's funny.

44:33 Scott Ingram: Now, what have been the most important decisions you've made or lessons you've had to learn to get where you are today?

44:41 Allen Schlesinger: So, um, persistence, I would say, is, is something you learn and you're not going to be able to please everyone all the time. I had clients that I've had amazing relationships with that for whatever reason just couldn't renew their season tickets the following year. And, and, and, you know, that's hard, but you have to learn to keep those relationships even though, you know, they're not going to be being season ticket holders the next year. Um, and then, you know, trying… I, I've evolved where now I'm, I'm trying to teach more with our other sales reps. So help them, you know, I'll either take them on my meetings or I'll go with them on theirs. And, and when I'm with them on theirs, it's really just trying to, you know, because I have a meeting strategy and it's not going to be the same as theirs. So it's really trying to just take a step back and let them run the show because it's their show and they're not going to get better if you just take over the meeting. And so really just trying to help, you know, others get better. And, and I've had other teams now in our league ask me to mentor, you know, their ticket sales managers, their sellers, where I'm doing phone calls with, you know, sellers from other teams quite often now just to, to help them get better. Because, you know, if other teams in our league get better, we're all going to get better.

46:03 Scott Ingram: Yeah, nice. Now speaking of teaching, I mean, is there some set of advice that you would give somebody who's just starting out in a new sales role today?

46:12 Allen Schlesinger: Embrace social. I mean, that's, that's a big key. And what I, what I tell them is, you know, you, you have an opportunity here where a lot of these teams that they're coming into, these new sellers, aren't embracing social. So doing something that can set you apart and make you successful will make you move up faster in your organization. So I've… some of these sellers I've talked to are literally week 2 or week 3 on other teams, and I tell them like, you know, is your team using LinkedIn to help your efforts? And sometimes they'll say no, and I'll be like, well, here's your opportunity to, to do something that could change your organization entirely. And so, you know, you have an opportunity here that not many other people have, so just utilize all the tools that are in front of you. I know They're going to encourage you to make 60 phone calls a day, but add this in, you know, outwork these people and then you'll get promoted a lot faster and get to where you want to be.

47:13 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Now, what does it mean to use social to you?

47:18 Allen Schlesinger: It's, it's using, I mean, it's mostly LinkedIn, although I do mix in Twitter and Facebook a little bit, but mostly LinkedIn to, to find potential buyers. And so it's searching creatively, um, you know, whether that's job titles like VP of marketing, VP of sales, CEO, CFO, executive assistants, um, all over the place. And then, you know, trying to figure out how to contact them using social. So whether that be email or LinkedIn.

47:53 Scott Ingram: Got it. What about somebody who's a little further into their career and they're… they only sold $300,000 last year and they want to catch up to you. What would you tell them to do?

48:04 Allen Schlesinger: That's, that's a tough question because, you know, obviously I want to stay as number one. Yeah, I don't want to share all my secrets. Um, but no, I mean, I, I would say, you know, probably just… I, I don't know what their target is every day or how many people they're targeting, but, you know, cast a wider net. I mean, that, and that's, I know it's like cliché, but I tell this to everyone I'm talking to, 'cause I'll ask them, I'll be like, are you really trying to target 100 new people a day? Well, you know, 40 or 50. Well, double your efforts or try to, and you'll see the results. And I've had, it's cool when like, 'cause I tell all these people from these other teams that I've worked with, like, keep me updated. Like, let me know if this is working or if this isn't working. And it's cool to hear like, success stories from people that I've spoken to, you know, that they've actually utilized social to help them land a larger deal.

49:00 Scott Ingram: Yeah. What now? 2, 2 questions, or maybe the same question. What are the things for those that reach back out to you and, and say, hey, Allen, this really worked, this is what I'm doing… what are they telling you that they're doing? Like, what stuck? And is there anything else that you're kind of sharing in those sessions that we haven't already talked about today?

49:19 Allen Schlesinger: I think what one, one tip that I, I give them that, that I think a lot more people are embracing now, and it was more of a, I'm scared factor to try this, was when you reach out to a company, you know, if you know one person's email address, you're gonna know everyone's at that company because all of them are the same format. So I tell them, like, I reach out to like the top 7 or 8 people at the company with the same exact message. I'm not worried that you know, the CFO is going to talk to the CEO and this annoying kid Allen reached out to me. I'm, I'm thinking one of the 8 likes basketball, so that's the one who's going to respond to me. And so I think that's helped, and that's some of the feedback I've gotten, is that like, you know, these doors from companies that wouldn't open before all of a sudden are opening because there was someone interested, but they never saw my email before because I would only email the CEO or the director of HR. So I think that's probably the biggest takeaway that I think people have gotten from, from my trainings.

50:18 Scott Ingram: Nice. And, and for you, do you count that as one? Is that one company or is that 8 because you had 8 different individuals in that company?

50:27 Allen Schlesinger: It's a little bit of both because like I was meeting with a tech company the other day and I've, I've started… well, I've known this for a while, but like the larger companies have different departments that each have their own budget. So I've actually sold tickets to companies 2 or 3 times, but they were like completely different people that were making the purchasing decisions. So I would treat it as initially as one company, but like if, if 2 different people want to meet, then, you know, potentially ask if they would want to meet together first because you don't want to show up for a meeting Tuesday and then go back Wednesday. It might be a little awkward, but tell them, you know, I already have a meeting with so-and-so, would you like to join the meeting? And so you might end up getting… uncovering, you know, a larger budget by doing that.

51:15 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Now, do you ever proactively take that approach where you've got sort of an anchor meeting with one individual and maybe you want to ping a couple of other people to say, hey, I'm meeting with so-and-so this day, do you want to join us?

51:24 Allen Schlesinger: I, I would, just to not like aggravate the person I'm meeting with, I would probably first ask them if they thought it made sense for anyone else in their company to be involved in the meeting.

51:34 Scott Ingram: Yep, makes sense. Now, if you were in my shoes, or in, in my socks as it were, um, what question would you want to ask? What would you want to know of top sellers in other organizations? I've…

51:48 Allen Schlesinger: what kind of, I guess, social efforts are you using to, to assist your selling efforts?

51:55 Scott Ingram: Nice. And I, I, I have a feeling I might be able to guess at this answer, but who's the most successful salesperson you know personally?

52:02 Allen Schlesinger: So I don't like to toot my own horn. So I would say I learn from everyone that I deal with. And so when I do these presentations and my numbers show up on the board, I always like to have my boss introduce me at these presentations because I don't like to talk about the numbers that were there. Like, I'd rather him do that because it's just… I, you know, self-promotion to me is… I'm not a big fan of it, honestly. And, and so, um, you know, I don't, I don't know if there's a single individual that, that I would say is like the best salesperson I know. It's just, you know, I like to just learn from people across all industries all the time.

52:49 Scott Ingram: Yeah, yeah. So it's kind of the best of… yeah, yeah. Is there anything that we haven't talked about yet that you were hoping that we would touch on?

53:00 Allen Schlesinger: No, I mean, I think, you know, if, if you're going to take away something from this is that, you know, try something new, you know. And, and this is going to salespeople across all industries, and, and what I do applies to salespeople across all industries because I've, I've done this presentation, like I said, for an IT company and, you know, some other non-sports companies. So it's not just sports teams that should be utilizing this. I think You know, if you're selling fruit or if you're selling, you know, computers, just across all industries, you know, try something new and it might separate you from the pack.

53:36 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Nice. And, and then along those lines, the last question is we try and make something very actionable, uh, for the listener. And since we do release new episodes every 2 weeks, I like this for it to be a 2-week challenge. So if you were challenging the person listening to this to do something over the course of the next 2 weeks to improve themselves and their sales results, what would that be?

53:57 Allen Schlesinger: Ramp up your efforts. I mean, if, if you, if you're failing to hit your quota, you know, look at yourself and say, am I really trying to target as many people a day as I can, or am I trying to do what I can just to get by? So just ramp up your efforts, and, and if that's not working, then, then try a different method.

54:21 Scott Ingram: Nice. Allen, this has been a blast. Thanks for coming over and sitting down with me today.

54:25 Allen Schlesinger: Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. Thanks for listening.

54:28 Scott Ingram: To the Sales Success Stories podcast. To be sure you never miss an episode and for an invitation to our Sales Success Community powered by Influitive, subscribe to our newsletter at top1.fm.