167: Constantly Iterating, Crafting Messaging & Avoiding Burnout with Dingus & Zazzy's Carter Davey

0:00 Scott Ingram: This episode is brought to you thanks to the generous support of Vidyard. To learn more about them and to download their free Chrome plugin, just click over to top1.fm/v for Vidyard.

0:20 Scott Ingram: You're listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast, where we deconstruct world-class sales performers to provide insights and strategies to help you improve. To learn more, visit us at top1.fm. Here's your host, Scott Ingram.

0:35 Scott Ingram: Today on the Sales Success Stories podcast, my guest is Carter Davey. Carter is the top seller for Dingus & Zazzy. Welcome to the show, Carter.

0:43 Carter Davey: Thanks, Scott.

0:44 Scott Ingram: So before we get into the context around what exactly Dingus & Zazzy is, why don't we kick things off like we always do with some immediate value and talk about the 3 things that you believe have contributed the most to your success as a sales professional?

0:57 Carter Davey: Absolutely. First and foremost, I think physical and mental health is really critical, especially in this role. You know, really, 2 would be messaging that kind of trails away from the norm. You have to find something that cuts through the fluff. And for myself, number 3 would be storytelling with a purpose.

1:14 Scott Ingram: Love it. Let's dig into each of those, and I'm sure we'll get even deeper as we get into this, but maybe kind of an example around each. So your first was kind of physical and mental health. How does that manifest?

1:25 Carter Davey: Yeah, I've found that in the role, especially doing it at a certain level, one of the biggest challenges that I had, especially when things get really busy and kind of get overwhelmed, was I wasn't keeping track of my physical and mental health. And within that, that was when I found that times that I struggled or felt burnout and really tapping into those things was, I guess, a bit of a eureka moment for me that I found that my performance definitely was tailored to how I took care of myself.

1:50 Scott Ingram: Very nice. We're coming back to that. What about… I'm most curious because I think this is always fun. You say messaging away from the norm. What is that? What does that look like?

2:00 Carter Davey: Yeah, I mean, I'm with a company called Dingus & Zazzy, so everything that we do is a little bit away from the norm, but I've found one of my biggest successes has been crafting messaging that really kind of cuts through noise, things that are sometimes potentially polarizing, but typically get us to, you know, the people that we'd prefer to work with.

2:17 Scott Ingram: And can you give me like an example of that?

2:19 Carter Davey: Yeah, I mean, a pretty good one for us is even through some of our cold email campaigns, you know, we've done things as outrageous as having a squirrel picture with a shocked face, you know, keeping things a little janky, a little light, and we found amazing amazing responses from that. And, you know, people just appreciate humor. So I think that's been something that worked out well for me and the rest of our team.

2:39 Scott Ingram: One of my favorite ways to break through the noise is with Vidyard. Inserting a video in your emails really stands out, especially if you can add some humor. And Vidyard will also notify you when those videos get watched. You can get started with their free Chrome plugin at top1.fm/v. And then your last point was storytelling. And I don't know if you want to tell us a story or, Kevin, to give us an example of how you use that.

3:03 Carter Davey: Yeah, I think in terms of some of the things that I know we'll get into in terms of, you know, things that we found a success or things that I worked through in my own experience, I found that really with my style, telling a story that could answer a lot of the questions but also be engaging, you know, really helped cut through, especially with somebody like me that has a lot of discovery calls every day. So not only is it fun to be able to talk about accomplishments, what we've done, we're a startup, but also, you know, it can answer a lot of questions. So when I say storytelling with a purpose, I mean, you know, not just saying it for the interest of this is who we are and this is where we came from, but also dropping in tidbits about the services we provide and really what we're doing that makes us special.

3:43 Scott Ingram: Very cool. All right. So 2 big things to come back to. We're going to talk about breaking through burnout, which is something I've been working on myself. And then I love the idea of lots of discovery calls. So curious about that, but let's get into the context now. Just help us understand what is Dingus & Zazzy? What is your role? What is that?

4:01 Carter Davey: Yeah, I guess Dingus & Zazzy, aside from being an outrageous name, is basically in the realm of creative and marketing resources. So typically on most marketing teams or most marketing pros, there's really only a few avenues that you go to really scale up your team or, you know, build resources in-house. And that's, you know, working with outside resources like freelancers, agencies, Upwork, Fiverr, things like that, or having to hire. And basically what we've done is we've hired the biggest and baddest creative and marketing team that we could. And we offer our services at a, you know, a flat monthly rate without an hourly cap. So in terms of what we're doing, some people look at it as kind of a SaaS model for creative work and bandwidth, but we really look at it as having flexibility, scalability, and being able to do, you know, most of the creative function at scale.

4:46 Scott Ingram: Very cool. And quick shout out to Matt McComb, who introduced us, who's a former Dingus & Zazzy employee. And I know he told me a story way back when about part of the name of the company is we just get people to say dingus a lot.

4:59 Carter Davey: I think I say it every day. I've been here over 2 years, so a long time in this company, but I say it every single day. I get to say the word dingus 100 times a day. I get to make other people say it. And I still don't know what the plural is, if it's dingi or dinguses, but that's something that me and Matt have debated for a long time.

5:15 Scott Ingram: So I think dinguses is funnier. So that's what I'm going to stick with.

5:19 Carter Davey: There you go.

5:20 Scott Ingram: So now let's talk about kind of the specifics of what you've done and why you're here. So I only interview number one, top 1% individual contributors on this show. So tell us what you did to get here.

5:34 Carter Davey: Yeah. You know, in my role, I think some of it even coming back to, you know, some of the team members I worked with coming into this role was, you know, straight from the fire hose would be an understatement. I started with the team as they were kind of expanding rapidly, but that was all based on the function of sales and specifically, you know, we're a very outbound shop. So coming into that, it was, you know, thrown into the fire and it was, you know, some of it and not necessarily in a negative way, but it was definitely sink or swim. And I think for myself, Going through all the iterations that a startup goes through and pivots, you know, from the journey of 10 to 150 employees in a couple of years is something that I really found my space in and being able to pivot and being able to kind of learn, but also found out what kind of produced results for myself. Coming back to some of the things around storytelling about my structure, about my routine, and was able to really fit into a product. I come from a background of not only sales, but also working in the kind of creative world. So it just, it was, you know, kind of a perfect storm. And for myself, really persevering through all the ups and downs and challenges that come through a fast-growing startup.

6:38 Scott Ingram: Nice. And then can you quantify those results for us?

6:41 Carter Davey: Yeah. In terms of where I've been, I just crossed my 2-year mark recently. I'm very much because of our kind of setup, you know, once somebody typically signs up with us, they have a better point of contact and their project managers who actually get to talk with them and work with them every day. So I kind of remove myself from the process. So within, uh, first month sales, as I call it, a little over $900,000, which, you know, translating to MRR, not having that necessarily available to myself. And we probably have an LTV of probably 5 to 6 months. So build a pipeline of a few million at least.

7:13 Scott Ingram: Very nice. Very nice. And then you hinted at some creative pieces in the beginning. What is your origin story? How did you get into sales in the first place?

7:21 Carter Davey: Well, sales is a funny one because sales is something that even as a kid, typically you ask people, hey, I want to be a firefighter, I want to be a police officer, I want to be an astronaut. I guess I have an astronaut photo. Branded with Dingus & Zazzy, but I always wanted to be in sales. That was something that I get from, you know, family. My dad's more of an enterprise sales guy, and growing up, I just kind of wanted to live that lifestyle. He's a, you know, top 1 percenter in his own right. So my journey through it and to get to it was, you know, very different. I spent a lot of my adult life, I guess, looking for direction, school, things like that. Uh, worked in the creative world, photography and design, and that's why, you know, coming towards something like Dingus & Zazzy was perfect. But even back before that, you know, I had worked in Various sales roles, management and retail, overseeing a big team on that side and a few stores, but then subprime financing, you know, a classic, classic greasy car salesman. And then really found my way to a role like this. And some of it was right place, right time.

8:18 Scott Ingram: Yeah, it's so funny because I think the most 2 common paths are you had a family member that did it, so you had like a true understanding of what sales actually was, or most of us just kind of fell into this and like, oh, look where I found myself and here we are. So I wonder You know, knowing what you know now, like from this point in your career, looking back, if you could start over, is there anything that you would have done differently from a career perspective?

8:41 Carter Davey: You know, I think in my own path, when I think about that personally, I would say no. But, you know, in terms of starting over and really just focusing on my sales career, I think I didn't realize how much entry-level positions there were to really start in, in terms of sales, whether that's, you know, from an SDR, BDR standpoint or finding even the startup world. I think I would have challenged myself to get into a role a lot earlier, but really from that standpoint, you know, happy with where things went. But if I had to think about it, yeah, it would have been, you know, trying to find an entry-level role and really get my feet wet as early as possible.

9:16 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So if you could do that, I mean, what type of entry-level role would you look for?

9:21 Carter Davey: Well, I think for myself personally, just because of the visibility I've had with something like Dingus & Zazzy being a very outbound-focused shop and really finding myself in that role. You know, I really would have looked to more of an SDR role, more of an outbound-focused role. And just realizing now in hindsight that that's something I'm very good at and confident with, you know, that's probably where I would have looked if I had to do things differently.

9:42 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And I have to imagine like that baseline skill set, I mean, you're going to use that in every sales role from then on, right?

9:48 Carter Davey: Yeah, truthfully. I mean, even as, you know, more of an AE-type role, you know, my ability for outbound or even working with a team that I'm able to give insight with, or, you know, I learned a million things from really good SDRs as well. But those skills translate into everything I do.

10:04 Scott Ingram: So yeah, love it. Well, let's tell an actual story. So I mean, heck, the show is called Sales Success Stories, so it feels like we ought to tell a story. What's your favorite sales story? And it could be a great win or it could be maybe it's an epic fail. Sometimes those make great stories too. Absolutely.

10:18 Carter Davey: I mean, there's no shortage of epic fails along the way and journey, but, you know, for a win and I think it's really on brand with kind of who we are at Dingus & Zazzy and what we do, but In the earlier days of our company, when we were a smaller team and we've never lost the scrappiness, but we've always had a lot of fun with what we do. And we had a, for ourselves at the time with the smaller team, you know, a very large brand approached us, pretty large IP that was just perfect, very humorous, you know, people that everybody on the team had looked up to for a long time without divulging too much. They were asking us to basically run an account, a social media account content with, you know, a couple million followers. And we figured that the best way we're going to do this is be painful. Ourselves. So in my, I guess, discovery call with their COO, I had 2 of the other team members that kind of worked in sales with me dressed in full bodyguard suits, sunglasses, everything, Secret Service. And they stood behind me on this call for 30 minutes without moving, without saying a word. I think at one point they handed me a phone and we just basically nailed the brand personality that they wanted to work with them. And that was really what we were going for. We figured that this was a brand that was super humorous, really out there, really edgy as we wanted to be. And so we figured I'd put our best foot forward and do something outrageous and it worked. And we've worked with them on and off for, I think since then, probably a couple of years now, which is the benefit of what we do is people can kind of come and go as they please.

11:46 Scott Ingram: Very cool. I love that. So you mentioned your discovery process again, and I love discovery. So why don't we talk about what that is? I'm guessing it doesn't always include bodyguards in the background, but what is kind of your typical discovery process?

11:58 Carter Davey: Yeah, not much anymore. I think, you know, and we'll probably touch on it a little bit later, but for myself, things have gone in and out of being kind of a one-person team on this side to having a team of people. So don't always have the bodyguards with me or the costumes ready to go. But in terms of discovery, I find that with my calendar, especially these days, and things have really changed. And when I had a lot more time with discovery, I felt like I would spend a lot of time, maybe too much time preparing and going over things where I really just needed a good formula and coming back to, you know, storytelling with a purpose, I found for myself that with my discovery calls, whether it's a 15-minute call or a 30-minute call, just because I pack so many into the day, I needed structure. And typically that starts with a bit of an origin story, you know, where we came from, because not only does it have some emotional value to the people that we're talking to, whether that's a marketing director or a founder of a company, but it also allows me to edge in some of the humor while also answering a lot of their questions. That typically is kind of the first 5 minutes of a call for me. I have that ironed out to the point that I can kind of do it at will. And then from there, it's really leaving the floor open and pushing as many questions about specifics that I can so I can tailor the rest of my pitch or a follow-up or the calls that we BAMFAM off of that to really just nail into pain points. But part of that has been more of my process, and I think that is something that I've just found, you know, really responded well for me.

13:21 Scott Ingram: Yeah, you just used a term that I don't think I've heard before. Did you say BAMFAM?

13:25 Carter Davey: It is. Yeah, I got this from… I believe the first time I heard it was from somebody I consider a friend and mentor, Jordan Rouse. But it was book a meeting from a meeting. So it was anytime you're in a meeting, book that follow-up call, get something on the calendar, get that ironed out before you get off the call.

13:41 Scott Ingram: I love it. I love it. It's a personal rule of mine because if you don't book the meeting while you're in the meeting, it is such a pain to get that next one, right? It's this ongoing, like, we're going back and forth in emails and I offered you that time and nope, now that time's not available. And yeah, BAMFAM, love it.

13:57 Carter Davey: It's a rule to live by. Absolutely.

13:59 Scott Ingram: Sweet, sweet. So you accomplished quite a lot, right? You're kind of riding this rocket ship in your astronaut suit. What are you most proud of?

14:06 Carter Davey: I think the easiest answer would be where we are today, or I guess my results, but I think it was the process we had to go with being on a fast-growing startup and especially with just the personality that we have. I think the biggest thing I'm proud of was at multiple times you go through so many iterations of what a sales team should look like. I've really been the common denominator, I think, in a lot of ways of consistency, consistently bringing in results when we couldn't figure out how to replicate that in a lot of ways on a team. And I think in certain ways, keeping the sales process or, you know, kind of front end of that revenue really coming in and keeping it consistent for the rest of our team. And definitely on a selfish standpoint, you know, I'm proud of numbers that we've done and what I've accomplished in a short time, but I really, um, you know, have built on the fact that being able to provide that to my team and the people that work here and being able to be the sole person who is responsible for that at times, I think is something I'm very proud of.

15:00 Scott Ingram: Yeah, I definitely want to come back to a lot of those things, right, in terms of what is the sales process and your habits and routines and all of that good stuff. But before we go there, let's go to the other side of the accomplishments. And that is like, what do you find to be the biggest challenge? Like, what do you struggle with the most? Or what have you struggled Yeah.

15:19 Carter Davey: And I think starting with what have I struggled with the most is actually the exact same thing that I'm proud of as an accomplishment is getting down to that point where having a limited bandwidth. And I think coming back to things like burnout, you know, being the sole, you know, person, whether that's the sales function, AE, you name it, and really being responsible for that. It's a lot when you have a lot of pace and, you know, we're very outbound focused, as I mentioned, but just having A calendar that's booked up is a great problem to have, but it was at a time where I really had to figure out some of those routines and things that I'm sure we'll get into to really balance out and keep myself from burning out. So although I'm proud of getting through all of that and being the sole person, I think I'm proud of not burning out. But it was really getting to those points where it was just, you know, myself on a team and having to juggle, I guess, every prospect and make sure that I had good follow-up. I had the right processes, I had the right automations and systems, so I didn't lose anybody or lose any deals. I think was probably something that was the most mentally challenging, not because it didn't produce results, but I knew that there were probably things that may have slipped through the cracks because I just didn't have the capacity to really keep up with them.

16:29 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that makes sense. Well, let's have kind of a special emphasis on how your routine sort of supported you not burning out and those types of things. And the way I usually like to talk through this is just give us a super detailed walkthrough your day. Your alarm clock goes off. Tell me what time that happened, and I want a pretty detailed blow-by-blow until your head hits the pillow again.

16:51 Carter Davey: Yeah, absolutely. It's funny, as a creature of habit, I'm probably one of the people that has a very loose routine. And when I say that, I mean my timing's all the same. I am up at quarter after 7 every day. You know, I'm not somebody that's gym before work, I'm always after work. But basically I get up, it's, uh, pound a big glass of water. That's something that I take from days of playing hockey. I don't know which coach got that in my head. I wish I could shout them out, but it was the biggest glass of water I could the second I woke up, shower, get ready for the day, leave myself enough time. So, you know, again, things of, you know, mental health and burnout. I've found I'm somebody who challenged with time in the past. So it's a big emphasis now. Out the door by 8 o'clock, into the office, typically a little bit early before our kickoff kind of sales team meeting at 8:30, giving myself enough time to get my numbers straight, get everything ready. And make sure I can cover all kind of the big important emails I got for the day before we do that. From there, we have a bit of a kind of pump-up session, I guess, with the team. We kind of go over everybody's day, you know, from all parts of our sales team, what we're looking at, get everybody excited. And a big part, again, of our company is just we like to have a lot of fun with everything. Any boring sales process or business process, we try to have fun all the way to text reminders. And I'm sure we can get into that. But You know, from there it is basically into mostly discovery calls for the morning. So from about 9:00 AM to about noon, I'm mostly packed up with discovery calls. Every now and then, if I have open slots, I'll book in some of those secondary meetings because I want to get those whenever I can. They're priority. But typically that could be sandwiched into, you know, 3 to 4 calls an hour sometimes depending on the time slots. From there, I've taken, you know, a bit of an hour break with my day, which I never used to. And to really reset lunch, sit down with the team, you know, kind of post-lunch in the second half of that hour and really just look at what we did in the morning, whether that was from my side, being able to share that with the team, some of their successes and digging into some things that they did in the morning, we can kind of focus on the afternoon. And then, you know, from there it's back to whether that's discovery calls, closing meetings, secondary calls through the process. And that takes me all the way to 5. I've really made a bit of a line in the sand, I think, with my time where, you know, I'm there until 5, and then making sure I leave myself enough room throughout the day. Typically from 3 to 3:30, I leave that window for email follow-ups, all of my information, examples of work, things that need to go out from my meetings that day. And then typically 5 o'clock hits and I want to cut it off there. Throughout the routine is I've found, you know, if I leave myself some room, I'll sit there until 9 PM. I'll find things to do and I'll find new people to follow up with from, you know, God knows how long ago. So 5 o'clock hits, I'm out of the office and, you know, whether that's going to the gym right after work or just something that is not related at all to work to kind of reset my mind before I get home, I really value kind of not taking that home with me and being able to unplug when I can.

19:44 Scott Ingram: And how big of an ingredient is that to the anti-burnout piece of kind of the cutoff at 5 o'clock?

19:49 Carter Davey: Yeah, for myself has been, I think, really important. I'm one of those people that, you know, regardless of whether I make that distinction at 5 o'clock and get out of the office and try and get it out of my mind. You know, I'm thinking of my discovery calls, I'm thinking of my closing calls, I'm thinking about these things constantly. But as long as it's not in front of my face, you know, it has been a game changer for myself just in terms of, you know, my routine around health and making sure I can stay active. Because, you know, when I was staying at the office till 9 o'clock at night, you know, just following up on things, getting prepared for the next day, I wouldn't catch the gym. I'm not an early morning person. I'm not somebody who can get there at 5. I know myself too well. That it was key for me.

20:27 Scott Ingram: Yeah. At what point did you make that shift and how did you do it? Because that's often not easy, right? If you're used to just continuing to go and go and go and now you're like, nope, I'm just going to stop.

20:36 Carter Davey: I should say it wasn't a hard line in the sand that one day I just did it. I think it was kind of reducing from 5 nights a week or working on the weekends, you know, staying late every day and getting in early. And don't get me wrong, there's a lot of success in that. But I think for myself, it was more important to stay consistent and reduce burnout. So it was kind of a slow burn over time where I think it really just started as, you know, I'd catch myself at about 5:15 going, you know, none of these things are too important to make sure that I'm closing deals. Like, let's get home, let's get more rest, let's get kind of cut off. And then over time, I just found that I started doing that every day and it was a radical shift in, you know, my mood, my ability, and really just how I function through life.

21:16 Scott Ingram: Did you see a difference in your results?

21:19 Carter Davey: You know, interestingly enough, yes. I think that in terms of consistency has been something that I think I'm very proud of. But there are, you know, the months that just sometimes skyrocket up and it's like, hey, what did I do differently? Was it opportunity? Was it myself? Where can I look at those things? And I found that the majority of times we did that, because we look at these things monthly, but not quarterly, it's fairly fast-paced for us. But those were a lot of the times where I found like I did separate myself a little bit more and I even find my ability and maybe it's just something that I think of and I can't tell you the numbers, but I can tell ever since I did that, I do feel a lot more confident even in my pitch and closing and It's been a big shift in results. Yeah.

21:57 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that's interesting. I mean, I think when you can be really focused like that, where you're like, look, I'm gonna get everything I can done in this amount of time, and then that's it. And you know that there's a finish line. It's not just nebulous and goes on and on and on throughout the evening otherwise, right?

22:11 Carter Davey: Yeah, absolutely.

22:12 Scott Ingram: So what does the rest of your evening look like? So you're not a morning person. I would guess that you have a little bit more of kind of an evening routine than you do a morning routine, because your morning routine sounds like get out the door, get to work.

22:21 Carter Davey: Yeah, exactly. So it's something I don't know when it started. I'm sure as a kid, but, you know, I really valued evenings. I'm definitely a bit of a night owl. So typically I try to do things at least outside of the house. I mean, I'm a guy with a, you know, apartment. It's not a lot of space from that standpoint right now. And so valuing my time outside of that as well, being in an area, you know, living in Edmonton, most people would not look at that as a, you know, a beautiful city, but at least I live close enough to a river valley where I try to spend some time after work once I get back to the apartment. Whether that's going for a walk or heading down to some of the local shops and stuff like that, just because I live so close, I try and do it every day. And then from there, once, you know, it's time to really kind of get home, typically around 6:30, 7, I'll probably head home. You know, I want to try and cook as much as I can. I think that was one of the things I found when it came to like physical health and really just moving at a million miles a minute being a sole AE was, you know, I wasn't really keeping track of my diet. I wasn't looking at those things. So I've really had to As much as I can build a routine around it, you know, I'm not perfect every day by any means, but I would say a typical day would look like that where it's, you know, come home, try and spend some time outside or at least getting out of my own space, get home, really just focus on kind of day-to-day stuff, whether it's making dinner, making sure I got something good. And then from there, it's whether I'm reading or I'm a big music nerd. So usually throwing something on and really just trying to decompress as much as I can once I get all the active stuff Yeah.

23:45 Scott Ingram: What is the information diet? What are you typically reading? Are you watching stuff? Like, what are those pieces?

23:49 Carter Davey: Yeah, I'm definitely a nerd in a lot of areas, but when it comes to reading sales material and things like that, I would say I'm pretty bad for that as a salesperson. I'm somebody who reads a lot of different material lately. I've been on a kick of, not to make myself sound smarter, I'm just, again, a nerd for these things, of books around astrophysics and things like that. And that was where my dream before, I guess, being a salesperson was getting into a world like that. So between that, I'm a big movie buff, so I'm typically watching something or have something on in the background while I'm working around the house. So I really look at my information diet as actually quite outside of sales. I do try and absorb as much as I can when I can, but I find that that home time is, you know, very specific for me just on a personal level.

24:32 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Any other habits or routines that are kind of central to your success or the way you operate?

24:38 Carter Davey: You know, I have found it's funny because, you know, sports seasons are something I grew up an athlete, obviously Canada being a hockey player. And, you know, nowadays I coach hockey, but that's only half of the season. So I always found that having that routine, because it's a little bit older, higher level, you know, definitely helped me in a lot of months. So I tried to translate that into the summer months as well. So really just activity in the evenings, you know, getting around sports, whether that's doing something like grabbing some friends and hitting a tennis court or just getting out on a bike. You know, those are things that I've found I lost in some of my early 20s, or especially getting kind of headfirst into sales that I've really tried to pick back up now.

25:14 Scott Ingram: Nice. Love that. Let's talk about the sales philosophy side of things. Like, do you subscribe to a particular philosophy? And we can talk about kind of your process from there.

25:22 Carter Davey: Yeah, I'm sure in some way I do. There's some people out there I really like and have followed for quite some time. You know, some of the guys like Jason Bay from some of the outbound stuff that they do was really influential on me, or Justin Michaels, you know, guys like that that I've definitely followed, but I wouldn't necessarily say I've subscribed to a certain philosophy. In that regard. I'm sure if you could, people that, you know, are more knowledgeable in all the schools of philosophy in sales out there would definitely say that I have a style, but not one that I found or built that style off of.

25:52 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So then what is kind of the process? Sounds like you sort of assembled your own that's been influenced by other folks.

25:57 Carter Davey: Yeah, definitely. And, you know, some of it was trial and error in a lot of ways. Other things were, you know, I know I've touched on storytelling a few times, but I really think the core for me has been centered around, you know, building that relationship, whether it's in a very short window or not, finding a common around with anybody. And I think that's something that I'm very proud of as somebody who never looked at myself as necessarily being the most outgoing person in the world, or extroverted person in the world, I should say, is the ability to kind of level with anybody, whether I'm talking to, you know, a CMO at a startup company that's scaling, or being able to talk to a CEO, you know, higher level, or just people from different walks of life. I really think that that's something I've carried throughout most of my life and is a really key ingredient in, I guess, my success in sales.

26:42 Scott Ingram: Yeah. And then what is the rest of your process? Right. So we talked about kind of the discovery process. What happens from there?

26:49 Carter Davey: Well, again, coming to the BAMFAM style, and that's just my acronym for it, you know, really making sure that everything's a little bit different in the world of Dingus & Zazzy. I mean, we have so many different avenues, so many different ways that we can kind of tailor the services we do, or I guess subscription packages. That it really gives me a bit of a blank canvas. So it's not typically the same process for everybody. Sometimes it is, you know, booking in and pushing for meetings and getting linked in with decision makers. It could be making sure that we have these secondary calls and making sure that they're in the right automations for myself or visibility. And really, from discovery call, I typically have only about 1 to 2 meetings on average before closing.

27:31 Scott Ingram: Okay. And then you just mentioned your automations. What is kind of the tech stack look like that supports this? What are the tools and apps that you're using day in, day out?

27:39 Carter Davey: Yeah, for myself, I mean, these days, you know, some of the things that I love and, you know, one tool I'd love to shout out that I don't get to use as much is more on ConnectAndSell, just with a more AE role. I think that that's something that was great that I couldn't live without for a long time. But today, you know, we're a pretty HubSpot-focused team in terms of what we're doing from automation sequences You name it. So I've been pretty well, I guess, headfirst into that environment for the past year and a half or probably almost 2 years now. So really looking at that as, you know, making sure I just have the right visibility on things and making sure the tool works well. But a lot of it for me is typically living inside of HubSpot, you know, we're Google Meet for everything. And that's really where I spend most of my time is within Google and HubSpot.

28:22 Scott Ingram: And then coming back to kind of the consistency thing, right? And it sounds like through a lot of your journey, you've had a lot of weight on your shoulders. Because you were kind of the guy that was supporting the business development side of the organization. What motivated you through all of that? How do you think about sort of motivation and drive in general?

28:41 Carter Davey: Yeah, it's been an interesting relationship with motivation, that's for sure. I think for myself, it really was getting a feel for the results. I mean, having the confidence and knowing that I have that consistency, and whether that's in a consistent level of pitch or being able to pivot and improvise with certain people, You know, a lot of my motivation has been centered around some of the early results I had within this business and team and my role. And it really has just compounded and really carried myself to have that drive to continue to learn, to continue to change. You know, sales is something that you're constantly learning, but really it all comes from a self-motivation. But I do have to give, you know, my team a lot of credit. We've built something that at the very least from an internal culture, you know, it motivates me to kind of come in every day. We do ridiculous things where everybody here is hilarious, basically spend half of my day laughing at, you know, whether it's silly things that we're doing in the sales process or just the environment I'm in. And it's a mixture of keeping myself self-motivated, reducing burnout. But, you know, sometimes it really is the teams or structure around you that can really help push that.

29:46 Scott Ingram: Yeah, that's fantastic. Say more about the… I've been on very much a culture kick this year, right? Because I think being in a great sales culture makes a huge difference. I mean, it's one thing when you're enjoying your job, enjoying your team, enjoying your work, you know, know that you've got a great product or solution that you're offering versus, well, I think we've all been in the other spot. So how do you think about that? How do you contribute to that?

30:10 Carter Davey: Yeah, absolutely. I think internally, especially on the sales side, speaking to that more, even within our physical office, I would say it's something that most people would think is just insane. You know, from the silly little things that we have, you know, like we have these tension bands that tend to fly around the room all the time. We have, you know, silly stuff on walls. We say sometimes outrageous things and, you know, not off base, but just in the way that even some guys approach their calls and some of the things that we can do and have the freedom to do and have fun with, I think is something that for the right person can really allow them to not only scale, but really utilize kind of the best parts of who they are to be a good salesperson. And with me, I'm somebody who really appreciates good humor and maybe not good humor, sometimes toilet humor. And, you know, within our culture and within a company named Dingus & Zazzy, you know, I have a lot of the freedom to do those things. Whether it's those squirrel emails or just being able to have things in the background or just the stuff that we have in the office is something that I never realized would be essential for kind of who I am and what keeps me motivated. But it is something, it's the only job I've ever had aside from results that I show up to every day or I leave the house to every day and I'm genuinely excited because I know I'm going to win or lose that day, I'm going to have at least a good time.

31:27 Scott Ingram: That's awesome. That's awesome. I think we were starting to get to a little bit of this idea that I want to ask you about before we started, and I kind of cut you off because I didn't want to get there too early. I didn't want to lead the witness too much, but I'm curious if there's something you believe that the average or typical sales professional would think is crazy. Oh boy.

31:46 Carter Davey: You know, a lot of it, I've probably touched on a few things there that most people would think is crazy in terms of our sales process or what we do. I think a big thing for myself too is even just being more on a straight sales side is I'm just not somebody who ever utilizes or really believes that discounting is always necessary. I don't know if that's something that is crazy, but for myself, it's a rare thing. I had a conversation with somebody the other day and they thought it was nuts that I rarely ever discount anything throughout our sales or what we do. But, you know, again, I think what most people would think is crazy is just the style we have and what I'm able to do, I guess, within that style with messaging, with pitching, with really just being able to lead a sales process with a lot of humor.

32:28 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Talk about this discounting thing a little bit more. I'm curious about both the philosophy around it and just how you execute it.

32:34 Carter Davey: Yeah, I think for myself, part of it was in an earlier time, not really having access to it as much and really having to build my belief in what we're doing and the price point that we're at. I've definitely, from a culture standpoint, even to touch on that, because I think it's relevant, is I've turned away business based on even just personality. If somebody is not going to be you know, somebody that's good to work with from our team standpoint, you know, I don't want to put that and my project managers in a position where they have to work with somebody that's going to be difficult or rude, which I know sounds crazy in sales because that's really not my job. But I think that comes back to my belief in the product and the price point and the value that we have that really I feel confident that I'm able to show that value without having to change a number, without, you know, having to give somebody an easy win. Because to me, if I don't show them that our price point is already an easy win for what we do, then I wasn't able to showcase the value at the level that I should.

33:30 Scott Ingram: Yeah, you know, that's some really good stuff there. So during the day, I have a regular quota-carrying sales job during the day, and I work for a professional services firm. And I share your philosophy there. You know, similarly, I won't… I just won't work with toxic clients because my team members are my product. And I want them to be happy. And I want them to be excited about working with our customers. And I want to put them through hell trying to work for just a ridiculously demanding client. And it's funny because I actually think that there's some association between that and the discount. Like, if price is all that matters to you, we're probably not the right fit for you.

34:04 Carter Davey: Yeah. And we've seen that again, you know, being in the way that we're separated. And I think you touched on something awesome is, you know, the people on my team are the product, they are the service. They have to interface on a daily level with our clients. And if they're not somebody that you know, at the very least can either treat me with respect or our process or talk about our team, it's not worth it. And, you know, it really isn't as a salesperson who's focused on numbers and revenue. It shouldn't be my job, but it's something that I'm definitely proud of to be able to bring to my team. And, you know, it is one of those things that does make you feel good as a salesperson to not only accomplish results and numbers, but the team always looks to you saying, these clients are awesome and everybody's happy. And, you know, something that, again, I think comes back to the belief in what we do. And why it's so important to me.

34:48 Scott Ingram: I think that's the other thing that is so great, and I love this space, right? I don't operate well inside of very large organizations, right? I love working with kind of the size of organizations that you and I work with because you get to have this broader impact, right? I'm so much bigger than just my number, right? It's also kind of the quality that I bring in and the way that we're able to impact, you know, the trajectory of the business and the type of work that we're doing. So it's not only don't bring in toxic stuff, but bring in stuff that's energizing, that, you know, can we help this company transform and make a real difference in their business? That's way more fun than just, yeah, we're just checking boxes and filling out our TPS reports.

35:27 Carter Davey: Yeah, I mean, exactly. I, I don't know how much better I could say that, but it is something that, you know, for myself was huge. And even going back to motivation, what's really kept me motivated is, you know, in finding my I guess space that I operate well in because I've worked at larger organizations all the way down to here. And A, being a part of something that you can build is great, but also being able to influence that and sometimes being able to only person, you know, that can influence that is something that I definitely take a lot of pride in.

35:54 Scott Ingram: Yeah. Well, that led to a fun conversation. I'm curious about sort of the flip side in terms of, is there something that the average or typical sales professional believes that you think is Oh man, you know, I really think sometimes structure, and I know I've touched on like having a lot of structure.

36:11 Carter Davey: I think that's something that we focused on a bit, but even within those discovery calls, I've found, at least in my experience, a lot of reps that I've talked to or worked with, you know, have a very set formula to that. And even though I talked about storytelling to start and this, it really depends on the person that I'm working with. So I really don't think in sales, depending on your product or depending on, you know, how specialized you're targeting or how niche the people you're targeting In my case, it's people of any industry, any size company where I have to pivot a lot. So maybe it's not what the average rep thinks, but I find hard locking yourself into too much structure is only going to be a limitation. You could probably be good, but it's, you know, really what's going to separate from that 1%.

36:50 Scott Ingram: Yeah, love that. Carter, what has been the most important decisions you've made or the lessons you had to learn to really break through and get to where you are today?

36:58 Carter Davey: Yeah, you know, coming back to at some points having to handle pretty much everything, I think there were times where I was looking for other opportunities or other options. And I think making the decision to follow through was something that I felt like I was, whether it was my own success responsible for building or, you know, what we've accomplished as a team, I think making the decision to go through the startup hurdles and the headaches and the pivots and the changes is something that I'm very, very glad I did, but also choosing to kind of work my way into sales, whether that was just starting, you know, subprime automotive financing And even sticking through that as not glamorous and pretty frustrating as that could be. You know, I think again, coming to that, a lot of these decisions came through just persevering through an opportunity. And I'm glad that I made the decision to stick around here.

37:49 Scott Ingram: Yeah. So what advice would you give to somebody that is at that point? They're just starting out in their sales career today. What would you tell them?

37:56 Carter Davey: You know, I think just starting out in a sales career, it really, regardless of where you are and you really have to immerse yourself in it. I have seen, you know, newer reps or maybe people on the SDR side and the people that have succeeded have, you know, maybe we're a bit different where you have the ability to kind of really be yourself in the process, but just really giving it everything, whether it's something that is glamorous or not. If you don't fully immerse yourself in it, at least from the hours of 9 to 5 or wherever you work, it's challenging to really break through. And I don't think that that means that you can't be good and have a great career, but I do think the people that do shine or succeed or have that tangible 1% success regardless of where they are, immerse themselves. I've been in roles in automotive where, you know, working at a very large dealership, the guys who made, you know, money that I thought was outrageous for a kid that was 22 years old were there constantly. They didn't take a day off. They really immersed themselves in it. And I take a lot of those values even in doing something quite a bit different nowadays.

38:57 Scott Ingram: So yeah, let's keep going with that. What advice do you have for somebody that is further in, right? So they've gotten to a point and, you know what, let's put this spin on it. They're on the edge of burnout, right? So what do you tell them to get through that period and find kind of that breakout success that they're probably on the cusp of, but may or may not see it?

39:15 Carter Davey: Yeah, I think in sales, everybody who's done it or getting to that level knows that you really don't stop, you know, learning and trying new things. I think, at least in the advice I could give for myself and trying to find a balance with reducing burnout, but also being able to break through has been trying basically brute force for myself, you know, and so it's tough, tough to say, you just, you have to try new things. You have to try new routines. You have to focus on, you know, things like your physical and mental health, because although I think, you know, immersing yourself in something is good and really helps you in your early phase, I don't think that that necessarily means that you don't have to look after yourself. And there's too many people in sales that I find go really hard for a long time and they find a lot of success and then it hits them like a wall. And I think it's, if you're on the cusp of burnout, know, small steps in the right direction are still a step in the right direction, whether it's a change in when you wake up, you know, some of the things that you're doing to look after yourself. At least for me, it was such a radical shift in my ability, my results, but also, you know, just my overall, I guess, health, if you will.

40:19 Scott Ingram: Yeah, yeah, great callouts. And obviously something like you shared with others that I've worked through. I'm actually in a really great place right now. I'm beginning to be talking about some of what I did and some of what helped me at our upcoming Sales Success Summit. We've covered a pretty good amount of ground. I wonder if there's something that I either didn't ask or that you were hoping that we would touch on that we maybe haven't gotten to yet.

40:41 Carter Davey: In terms of from my side, I think some of the things that I'm always curious about, or I guess I've learned from listening to other previous sales success stories here, has always just been around organization. I think it's something that I'm very open about having a challenge with at times, especially at scale. Sale and always curious to figure out where that falls into other reps, top sellers, things like that. And I think it's something that, you know, for myself to be transparent, although things feel organized or at times can be and they are, it's just, I'm always curious to see where that falls in for other people. And so I just wanted to shout out that I'm, as somebody who's broken through and had to deal with a lot of bandwidth issues, you know, finding a good balance of organization is always something that's interesting, whether that's day to day with calls and prospects projects or just your routine. And yeah, I guess more of a point that I just wanted to make that, you know, it's great to have structure. It's great to have these things, but if you don't work at things that, you know, you're not good at every day, you're not going to be able to fix them.

41:39 Scott Ingram: So yeah. Any specific tips in that area that you have found kind of help you in the organization place, even though it's maybe not your biggest strength?

41:46 Carter Davey: Yeah, it's very crude for myself. So I'm a very visual person. I need visibility on what I'm doing. And sometimes even having 3 monitors isn't enough for that. So for myself, it's a crude whiteboard, or it's having a spreadsheet, or just having something centralized that maybe isn't in the tech stack that I look at all day, every day, because my eyes can get lost in HubSpot, you know, bouncing between my pipeline, my contacts, my sequences. It's really easy for me to get lost in those tools and my screen. So, you know, for me, I'm an analog person. A lot of times it's notepads, it's whiteboards, it's having things that I can turn my chair and look at. And silly as it sounds, that was an absolute breakthrough for me.

42:25 Scott Ingram: So, you know, it's so interesting you call that out, and I've actually seen it to be fairly common. I mean, I love technology, I use a lot of technology, but in so many of these conversations, and in some ways myself, I have found that, you know, a lot of top performers, at some level, you have to kind of get away from the tech in order to just kind of be focused and have it in one place. And sometimes that's on paper, or it's a whiteboard, it's completely analog to your point. Yeah.

42:51 Carter Davey: And I feel like, you know, especially in sales and in our world, everything being so digital, I mean, we all live in sales on… we don't even live on a phone anymore. It's a virtual dialer. So everything for me, at least as a person and where I can focus, I need visibility or else I know things will get by me, even with automations, even with reminders. That's knowing myself and making sure that I can have a good process, you know, even like a whiteboard and some markers just to keep me Yeah, yeah, excellent.

43:18 Scott Ingram: I'm deep in summit experience planning right now, and there's some really interesting kind of analog things I'm looking to bring to that experience. So a little hint for everybody that's planning to join us here in Austin in October. Carter, I always like to end these conversations with something actionable, right? I mean, we've talked about a lot of stuff, but what would you suggest that our listener do over the course of, say, the next 1 to 2 weeks to improve themselves and improve their business? Their results?

43:43 Carter Davey: In terms of improving yourself, I think, again, we've touched on it a lot, it is reducing burnout. And I don't know if it's a blanket statement for everybody out there, but even just tweaking something in the routine that maybe you don't find is perfect, and it could be something as simple as when you get up or what you do when you get up. But I think for me that constantly tweaking and knowing, hey, this isn't working well for a good routine, this isn't going to stick, is something that I've found again, brute forcing, split testing, whatever you want to look at it for, is, you know, just really, again, in the world of sales, it's constantly improving, it's iterating and trying something different. And, you know, whether that's the structure in which, you know, you start your calls or really how you keep yourself organized, you know, I know it's not specific, it's kind of a blanket statement, but really trying to find that one thing in your routine that maybe you're not 100% in love with and just try something different. If it works, great. If it doesn't, go back to what you were Love it.

44:37 Scott Ingram: Love it. Something small, something actionable, something they can do right now. Carter, this has been great. Super on point. Appreciate the time.

44:42 Carter Davey: Absolutely. Thanks so much, Scott. Thanks for listening to the Sales Success Stories podcast. To be sure you never miss an episode and for an invitation to our Sales Success Community powered by Influitive, subscribe to our newsletter at top1.fm.